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By: - 1st September 2004 at 20:05 Permalink - Edited 1st January 1970 at 01:00
In the Australian Financial Review today (31/08/04, on page 2), there is a short column on the Thai government trying to exchange 250,000 tons of chicken meat for Sukhoi jet fighters.. Apparently the Thai's cannot sell the meat due to the bird flu that has struck their poultry industry in recent times.No mention of numbers or exact type of Sukhoi's the Thais are interested in.
(unfortunately I have no link, as I read newspapers the old fashioned way)
Prices of fried raw boneless chicken meat have increased rapidly from some $1.200/ton to unbelievable $2.300/ton after Chinese and Thailand announced the flu, but on a long run an average price of $1.600/ton could be calculated. That makes some $400 mil in total.. Won't be too much for a fleet of Su-30s.
By: - 1st September 2004 at 20:07 Permalink - Edited 1st January 1970 at 01:00
http://www.themoscowtimes.com/stories/2004/08/31/042.html
http://10.128.20.112:15871/cgi-bin/blockpage.cgi?ws-session=822493825
By: - 1st September 2004 at 22:30 Permalink - Edited 1st January 1970 at 01:00
Moscow Times
August 31, 2004
Pg. 5
Thailand Pushes Proposal To Swap Frozen Chicken For Jets
By Bloomberg
BANGKOK, Thailand -- Thailand, which has about 60,000 tons of frozen chicken meat that cannot be sold because of an import ban, is in talks with Russia to exchange poultry for fighter jets, a Thai trade group said Monday.
The Thai government offered to swap about 250,000 tons of chicken over the next five years for fighter aircraft made by Sukhoi Holding, theThai Broiler Processing Exporters Association said in a faxed statement.
Thai chicken exports this year may fall 60 percent to 200,000 tons, the lowest shipment since 1996, after Japan, European Union members and other countries banned chicken meat imports from the Southeast Asian country following the bird flu outbreak.
The Thai government has confirmed bird flu virus infections among poultry in 25 of 76 provinces since the virus reappeared last month.
Thai exporters have about 60,000 tons of frozen chicken meat in storage that they are unable to sell because of the ban, according to commerce ministry data published Aug. 19. Thailand is the world's fifth-largest chicken meat exporter.
Prachuab Chaiyasarn, the government's trade representative, will meet Russian officials from Sept. 5 to Sept. 8 for further negotiations about the chicken-for-aircraft proposal, the statement said.
Prachuab was in Denmark and not available for comment, his secretary said. She confirmed Prachuab will travel to Moscow next week for talks about chicken meat exports.
Russia imports as much as 1.1 million tons of poultry per year, or about half of the 2 million tons that it consumes.
The United States is the biggest supplier, providing about a third of Russia's poultry.
By: - 2nd September 2004 at 00:58 Permalink - Edited 1st January 1970 at 01:00
Ummm Thai AF interested in Sukhois? I thought they were all Western hardware and fine with F-16 ADFs.
By: - 2nd September 2004 at 04:46 Permalink - Edited 1st January 1970 at 01:00
Would be yet another export breakthrough for Russia. Malaysia, Indonesia, Vietnam and now Thailand.
By: - 2nd September 2004 at 04:54 Permalink - Edited 1st January 1970 at 01:00
Ummm Thai AF interested in Sukhois? I thought they were all Western hardware and fine with F-16 ADFs.
that's what I thought too! but perhaps we should wait. maybe htey're purchasing Sukhoi turbo prop trainers, after all they did buy an "Eastern" jet powered trainer.
By: - 2nd September 2004 at 08:45 Permalink - Edited 1st January 1970 at 01:00
The article clearly says 'fighter jets'. Maybe they are looking to Su-30MKs in response to the Malaysian deal, and the Vietnamese plans. Not to mention they could be looking to Su-30MK to bolster their martime strike capability. Could take them a LOT longer to get Harpoon and something from the US to carry and fire it. :p
By: - 2nd September 2004 at 08:58 Permalink - Edited 1st January 1970 at 01:00
The article clearly says 'fighter jets'. Maybe they are looking to Su-30MKs in response to the Malaysian deal, and the Vietnamese plans. Not to mention they could be looking to Su-30MK to bolster their martime strike capability. Could take them a LOT longer to get Harpoon and something from the US to carry and fire it. :p
silly me, you are correct! I guess it pretty much narrows it down to the Flanker..
By: - 2nd September 2004 at 10:42 Permalink - Edited 1st January 1970 at 01:00
In fact, there are not too much choices to stay oriented on Western hardware while facing an armada of Su-30s from every side. Even F-15T would have very hard time to cope and that is something Thailand and many more coutries cannot afford, anyway.. Could be an interesting situation, if Su-30 spreads like Ebola thru the whole Asia...
By: - 2nd September 2004 at 15:47 Permalink - Edited 1st January 1970 at 01:00
I personally think they should just buy more F-16s, give them the MLU upgrade and like Chile get Israeli weapons integrated with them like Derby, Python 5 and of course the latest Gabriel AshM(though not as good as Yakhont-M, still very good and Thailand has already done this when they bought the L-39ZAs with Israeli weapons and avionics). If anything, I'd rather buy some S-300PMU2s or invest in S-400(these SAMs should be very cheap solutions and easy to integrate in Western oriented militaries), if F-16MLUs are not good to counter those hordes of Flankers in South Asia.
The Flanker is a good plane, but it will be costly integrating another aircraft type in the Thai AF, which traditionally uses Western types, at least SAMs will not be hard to integrate with it's AD or Army.
I think F-16MLU with Derby and Python 5 + S-300PMU2/S-400 will be enough to counter those Flankers and will be very cost effective.
Also, maybe in order to support those F-16MLUs, some sort of AWACS could be bought, maybe the Phalcon, or the Hawkeye or hell even the cheap Erieye are options.
By: - 2nd September 2004 at 15:53 Permalink - Edited 1st January 1970 at 01:00
Thailand, its huge poultry industry stricken by bird flu, wants to pay for Russian weaponry with chickens, the Reuters news agency quoted the country’s prime minister Thaksin Shinawatra as saying.
Thaksin said he had ordered his ambassador in Moscow to offer Thai chicken for Russian weapons and that he would consult with military chiefs on what arms they wanted.
“Our chicken exports have been hit by bird flu,” Thaksin told reporters on Tuesday. “When we can’t sell in our traditional markets, we need to penetrate new markets by bartering. We can’t leave all this chicken in Thailand.”
Thailand, the world’s fourth biggest chicken exporter until the industry was ravaged by bird flu early this year, has never exported poultry to Russia.
But with the European Union and Japan, its biggest customers, barring imports of Thai fresh and frozen chicken, it has been offering incentives like cheap credit to Asian countries willing to buy Thai poultry.
Thaksin gave no hint on whether warplanes were on his Moscow shopping list, but Russia’s Vedomosti business daily reported on Wednesday that Bangkok wanted to buy at least six Sukhoi Su-30s worth $200 million.
It quoted a source close to Russia’s arms trade authority as saying Thailand, which has equipped its air force with U.S. fighters, had sent a defence delegation to Russia recently to Irkut, which has a licence to produce the Su-30.
Another company making Su-30s is state-owned Sukhoi Corporation, Russia’s top arms exporter, which forecasts 2004 sales at $1.5 billion and plans to export 40 fighters.
Su-30s, together with MiGs, form the backbone of Russia’s arms trade and go mainly to Southeast Asia, where Indonesia, Vietnam and Malaysia have long been buyers.
Boosting defence exports is part of President Vladimir Putin’s plan to revive the arms sector, but sales are still a tiny fraction of what they were in Soviet times.
Last year’s arms sales hit a post-Soviet record of $5.4 billion, mainly on strong demand from Southeast Asia. Fighter jet sales make up about two-thirds of Russia’s arms exports.
By: - 2nd September 2004 at 22:14 Permalink - Edited 1st January 1970 at 01:00
“Our chicken exports have been hit by bird flu,” Thaksin told reporters on Tuesday. “When we can’t sell in our traditional markets, we need to penetrate new markets by bartering. We can’t leave all this chicken in Thailand.”
It is obvious that the driving issue for Thailand is how to get rid of tons of chicken meat it couldn't sell in its traditional market, not any specific hankering for Sukhois.
"We can’t leave all this chicken in Thailand.”
HA HA HA HA HA HA HA
Sorry.
By: - 2nd September 2004 at 22:59 Permalink - Edited 1st January 1970 at 01:00
It is obvious that the driving issue for Thailand is how to get rid of tons of chicken meat it couldn't sell in its traditional market, not any specific hankering for Sukhois."We can’t leave all this chicken in Thailand.”
HA HA HA HA HA HA HASorry.
Besides Sukhois what else Russia exports. I have been told that Russians make very energy efficient air-conditioners (though they don't look that nice compared to western ac's)
By: - 2nd September 2004 at 23:37 Permalink - Edited 1st January 1970 at 01:00
Why would anyone want to buy the bird flu infected chicken. They ought to be responsible and burn the meat....or eat it themselves
By: - 3rd September 2004 at 06:34 Permalink - Edited 1st January 1970 at 01:00
I just remember that this is not the first time that a westernized Asian military is buying Russian weapons through barter.
South Korea got T-80s mbts and BMP-3 apcs as payments for debt that the Russians owed Seoul. Russia simply doesn't have the hard currency and military stuff is about the only finished product that it could trade (Russia is loath to barter raw material like oil or titanium which represents hard currency on a far more equitable level.)
Russia still owes Seoul a few more billions so there might be more coming. I don't recall why S Korea chose apvs over aircraft.
If Thailand gets the chicken deal, the Chinese Sukhoi customer should be pi$$ed. China had to barter textiles like good silk shirts and ties for the Su-27SK (as will as 50-60% hard currency.)
Thailand is gonna get the plane by trading for it with a perishable like frozen chicken. The Thais are good businessmen :D
By: - 3rd September 2004 at 06:58 Permalink - Edited 1st January 1970 at 01:00
If Thailand gets the chicken deal, the Chinese Sukhoi customer should be pi$$ed. China had to barter textiles like good silk shirts and ties for the Su-27SK (as will as 50-60% hard currency.)Thailand is gonna get the plane by trading for it with a perishable like frozen chicken. The Thais are good businessmen :D
The recent Indonesian FLANKER deal was also largely settled with the barter of commodities. Nobody got angry with that. I believe frozen chicken can be good for up to 6 months or perhaps more, or is that fish? I am not sure.
By: - 3rd September 2004 at 07:11 Permalink - Edited 1st January 1970 at 01:00
The recent Indonesian FLANKER deal was also largely settled with the barter of commodities. Nobody got angry with that. I believe frozen chicken can be good for up to 6 months or perhaps more, or is that fish? I am not sure.
Probably less than 6 months. Meats get the distinctive "freezer flavor" after a few months in storage.
I think it would be a better deal if the Thais bartered for a few An-225s and then use them to airlift the frozen chicken out of the country quicker before they spoil.
If they airdropped the chicken in the middle of a Russian winter, there wouldn't be any need for refrigeration.
By: - 3rd September 2004 at 08:04 Permalink - Edited 1st January 1970 at 01:00
Probably less than 6 months. Meats get the distinctive "freezer flavor" after a few months in storage.I think it would be a better deal if the Thais bartered for a few An-225s and then use them to airlift the frozen chicken out of the country quicker before they spoil.
If they airdropped the chicken in the middle of a Russian winter, there wouldn't be any need for refrigeration.
GD - :p :p
By: - 3rd September 2004 at 08:12 Permalink - Edited 1st January 1970 at 01:00
I personally think they should just buy more F-16s, give them the MLU upgrade and like Chile get Israeli weapons integrated with them like Derby, Python 5 and of course the latest Gabriel AshM(though not as good as Yakhont-M, still very good and Thailand has already done this when they bought the L-39ZAs with Israeli weapons and avionics). If anything, I'd rather buy some S-300PMU2s or invest in S-400(these SAMs should be very cheap solutions and easy to integrate in Western oriented militaries), if F-16MLUs are not good to counter those hordes of Flankers in South Asia.The Flanker is a good plane, but it will be costly integrating another aircraft type in the Thai AF, which traditionally uses Western types, at least SAMs will not be hard to integrate with it's AD or Army.
I think F-16MLU with Derby and Python 5 + S-300PMU2/S-400 will be enough to counter those Flankers and will be very cost effective.
Also, maybe in order to support those F-16MLUs, some sort of AWACS could be bought, maybe the Phalcon, or the Hawkeye or hell even the cheap Erieye are options.
Srbin,
Force logic aside, there has to be a good reason why they would consider Su-30MKs now. Think endurance, think long range maritime strike, think long range interdition. The warmed over F-16A/B/C/D is not in the same class.
By: - 3rd September 2004 at 08:45 Permalink - Edited 1st January 1970 at 01:00
The recent Indonesian FLANKER deal was also largely settled with the barter of commodities. Nobody got angry with that. I believe frozen chicken can be good for up to 6 months or perhaps more, or is that fish? I am not sure.
Not a big deal.. Finnish F/A-18C/Ds were also bartered for godonlyknowshowmany trillions tons of conserved fish..
Posts: 644
By: Dubya - 31st August 2004 at 04:38
In the Australian Financial Review today (31/08/04, on page 2), there is a short column on the Thai government trying to exchange 250,000 tons of chicken meat for Sukhoi jet fighters.. Apparently the Thai's cannot sell the meat due to the bird flu that has struck their poultry industry in recent times.
No mention of numbers or exact type of Sukhoi's the Thais are interested in.
(unfortunately I have no link, as I read newspapers the old fashioned way)