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Thread: ID of control column

  1. #1
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    ID of control column

    'Afternoon all, I need the help of the experts once again. We have a control column in Irish Military Archives which we would like with your assistance to identify.

    Markings.... 312/35, BSA G4 and also the BSA symbol. AID 5HO (Inspectorate I presume). On the levers BSA G3 and BSA G4.
    131 (on shaft below grip) 225 s.

    Many thanks as always

    Tony Kearns
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  2. #2
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    Hawker family of prewar biped. Likely Hart.
    But similar fitted to Hind, Fury

  3. #3
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    Ps, happy to give it a home lolo😀😀😊

  4. #4
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    Thanks Tony , sounds like the Hind as the Air Corps operated the Hind and Hector, would the Hector be identical?
    We hope to have it on loan at the Air Corps Museum to clean it up. Thanks again, your assistance is much appreciated.
    Tony K

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  6. #6
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    Thanks again Tony, as the Hind and Hector had forward firing machine guns where was the firing buttons located ?.

    Tony K

  7. #7
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    The firing buttons are the two thumb levers on the spade grip captain!
    Our Beech 18 & T-6@www.beechrestorations.com
    Visit Sywell Aviation Museum @
    www.sywellaerodrome.co.uk/museum.php
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  8. #8
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    Afraid not a captain only an 'erk TT.
    They only had one gun, why the two levers?

    regards
    TonyK

  9. #9
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    Standard Spade Grip? I’ve got one myself! ��
    Our Beech 18 & T-6@www.beechrestorations.com
    Visit Sywell Aviation Museum @
    www.sywellaerodrome.co.uk/museum.php
    Sywell Airshow 17.8.2014

  10. #10
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    Tony
    Please correct if wrong I understand they’re wheel brake levers, not gun buttons. The left one is connected to the left wheel brake and the right on to the right wheel brake. Steering the aircraft on the ground was by differential braking whereas when stopping you press both together.

  11. #11
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    I always thought they were gun triggers, but I may be wrong. Certainly they did not have a standard brake lever like Dunlop spade grips. I have a Hart mainwheel, does not have brakes, so did any of the Hawker bipes have wheel brakes?

  12. #12
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    "Tony
    Please correct if wrong I understand they’re wheel brake levers, not gun buttons. The left one is connected to the left wheel brake and the right on to the right wheel brake. Steering the aircraft on the ground was by differential braking whereas when stopping you press both together.



    That is what I said initially when shown the Spade Grip at Military Archives, which was why I am wondering now where the location of the firing button is located on the aircraft

    Tony K

  13. #13
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    On reading fellow forumite Air Ministry's fabulous 'An illustrated guide to British Aircraft equipment 1939-1945 Volume 4 - 'Dunlop Spade Grips and gun Firing Gear' page 132, there is mention that when this handle is fitted to an aircraft with only one gun fitted, the right hand trigger is connected to the firing mechanism of the gun and the left hand trigger used to operate a gun camera, if fitted. Perhaps AM can provide a little more information???

    GYD

  14. #14
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    I was reading Roland Beamont's wonderful book Flying To The Limit recently and he mentions using brakes on a Hawker Hart during his training. There is also a photo in the book of the instruments and control column of a Hart and it looks remarkably similar to the one in discussion.

  15. #15
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    I've looked through my collection of contemporary cockpit photos and it looks like the majority of these Hawker types had the two trigger spade grip, i.e. Hart, Demon, Audax, Fury, etc.

    You should be looking on the column for part number clues as that will help to positively identify the type from which this came.

    I think the confusion about the use of the levers for operating the brakes may come from restored examples which have been converted from Palmer foot operated hydraulic brakes (spares "unobtainium"?) to hydraulic brakes, using the gun triggers in this way.

    Thanks for the kind comments about the book, GYD!
    The garage that keeps on giving.

  16. #16
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    AM, I am beginning to get the picture, at my age these things happen. All the details we were able to see are in my original posting

    Thanks to all for taking the trouble.
    regards
    Tony K

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