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Thread: Finnish fighter replacement revisited

  1. #181
    Join Date
    Jun 2008
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    My understanding of the Finnish eval is that unlike many others it will first short-list, and then it will pick the most capable solution amongst those short-listed.

    Gripen no doubt is very cost-effective (if payload/endurance requirements are met) however it will not be able to beat the F-35 if one of the main criteria is ranking of technical capabilities. There is so much capability in the F-35 a/c (built-in) that no 4.5 gen fighter will be able to compete. IMHO.

    Had they chosen to instead define "minimum capability criteria" and then select the cheapest package then perhaps Gripen E would have had a chance in Finland. But with their process I don't think it will have a chance.

    Politics may also play a role, in favor of a US solution. Sweden is a near neighbor and very important partner to Finland of course, but after the Swedish military has been decimated over many years, I don't see Sweden ever become in a position to give any substantial support to Finland, Sweden will struggle to defend itself! The only country that can support Finland and provide a credible deterrence is the US. Thus if Finland believes that the US support will still be there (in spite of all the America First talk) then politically it makes the most sense to buy US fighters.

  2. #182
    Join Date
    Nov 2011
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    There is plenty very capable of hardware to shop in Sweden for the Fins. Given the expectations expressed in the RFP, the Gripen is not one of them.
    The Gripen has never been designed to be the most capable penetrative platform in the world. Not is it Saab motto, nor Sweden budget.

  3. #183
    Join Date
    Feb 2012
    Posts
    567
    Finlands situation and Swedens are quite similar, and even more so when Sweden and Finland will enter a new era of military cooperation where Fins can utilize Swedish airbases, Swedish equipment and use joint forces on eachothers territories.
    There are no such plans of military co-operation. Finland occassionally throws some softballs to that direction, and Swedes are always "mm...meh."

    My understanding of the Finnish eval is that unlike many others it will first short-list, and then it will pick the most capable solution amongst those short-listed.
    Yes, it is basically opposite for Swiss process where they estabilished minimum performance criteria, and then picked out the cheapest. Same applies for support and domestic industry co-operation- there is a minimum level which everyone must meet, if they don't they are out regardless of any other considerations. But it also means you can't "buy" points by promising extra super duper industry co-operation or anything like that.

    However, all of those are just Air Force criteria, in the end it is the State Council which decides which and how many aircraft - if any - is acquired.

  4. #184
    Join Date
    Jan 2012
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    3,602
    olitics may also play a role, in favor of a US solution. Sweden is a near neighbor and very important partner to Finland of course, but after the Swedish military has been decimated over many years, I don't see Sweden ever become in a position to give any substantial support to Finland, Sweden will struggle to defend itself! The only country that can support Finland and provide a credible deterrence is the US. Thus if Finland believes that the US support will still be there (in spite of all the America First talk) then politically it makes the most sense to buy US fighters.
    Sweden is strongly rearming. Conscription, remilitarization of Baltic island, reparation of airbases etc.

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