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Thread: Indian Air Force Thread 21

  1. #661
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    The Akash missile has been test fired for a second time on Wednesday. 1 missile was test fired against an electronic target on Tuesday and two missiles on Wednesday.

    http://www.newindianexpress.com/nati...t-1713166.html

  2. #662
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    Yes a lot of cheap crap comes out of China, so does a lot of well engineering stuff (a lot of which is very popular in India as well, eg. Xiaomi Note 4). With a 22% share in the world's manufacturing output, that's pretty much inevitable.
    It is not just manufacturing. The big data is code word of all the data that is collected by all the devices including satellites than use supercomputers to siff through it. Chinese has very vast network with skilled manpower. India simply cant compete. it simply don't have that much information to improve its products.
    http://news.xinhuanet.com/english/20..._136779406.htm
    MOSCOW, Nov. 25 (Xinhua) -- China and Russia will enhance cooperation on digital economy, including big data, the Internet of Things and smart cities, Chinese Ambassador to Russia Li Hui told Xinhua in a recent interview.

  3. #663
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    Quote Originally Posted by TooCool_12f
    When fully armed, the Rafale can carry up to 15t of fuel and weapons, the proportions of which you can adjust depending on the mission you have to perform) the Tejas 7t.
    Tejas figure is gross wrong ... load weights are 9.5t of Tejas vs 15t of Rafael ...

    Experience does matter but its plain wrong to assume that new entrant can't bring world-class innovation. Its well known, Nokia/Ericson died while apple or samsung are the new market leaders. Where are the UK/Germany/Eu fighter programs today, while they were the number one during 1950-70s. They will/are losing their edge to China/India ... let's see what next 10-30 years bring.

    Tejas and Rafael belong to a different class but have the comparable capability - e.g. sortie rates, up keeping, electronics and avionics wise, Teajs is much cheaper to operate, maintain and upgrade.

  4. #664
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    The IAF has asked the Drdo to equipe the upcoming A330 based Awacs with aerial refueling capabilities so as to double up as an air to air refueller.

    While this may sound dumb and insane but after some thought I think this will indeed be a great thing. Usually the acs escorting the awacs will be Su-30MKI and they can remain in the air for 3.5 to 4 hours without aerial refueling. If these escorting fighters can be refuelled by the awacs then there will be no need for another pair/batch of Su-30. The MKI also won't have to leave station and go to the refuelled to get refuelled. And it will alleviate the pressure on the small fleet of IL-78M currently in service. The way I see it, these A330 won't be full fledged aerial refuellers but will have a secondary refueling capability.

    https://economictimes.indiatimes.com.../61862710.cms#


    NEW DELHI: The next-generation airborne early warning and control system (AWACS), with a 360-degree scan being developed by the DRDO, would also double up as an air-to-air refueller following a request by the Indian Air Force (IAF), according to a top DRDOofficial.

    The IAF, which is bearing around 80 per cent of the project's cost, had asked Defence Research and Development Organisation(DRDO) to equip Airbus A330 wide-bodied AWACS aircraft with refuelling capability.

    "Negotiations with Airbus had been completed on the basis of the in-principal approval given by the government and an RFP (request for proposal) that was floated. We will be buying six aircraft, and may buy two more under the option clause later," S. Christopher, DRDO chief, told IANS.

    The Airbus A-330, a medium to long-range wide-body twin-engined jet, which emerged as the single bidder for the tender floated by India, is likely to be the platform for the next generation AWACS systems, which will double up as mid-air refuellers.

    "Adding this refuelling capacity will give a multi-functional role to the platform. It will also be economic as the cost will be around 36 per cent lower," Christopher said.

    As the proposal was put to the air force, it asked DRDO if it was possible to include air-to-air refuelling. "The AWACS fly with buddy aircraft to protect it, which can also be fuelled by the same aircraft," he said.

    Since the Airbus A-330 had already an in-principal approval for the AWACS system, the DRDO did not want to go through the process again which may have resulted in cost escalation of the platform.

    The DRDO official said a "tech scan" of the platform was carried out, and it was found that the Airbus A-330 could be used for both purposes. The committee undertaking the tech scan had a member from the DRDO, apart from the IAF and the defence ministry.

    The IAF at present has two AWACS systems -- the Israeli Phalcon AWACS on the Russian IL-76 and an indigenous system mounted on a Brazilian Embraer-145 that was handed over to IAF by DRDO at the Aero India 2017. Two more Embraer aircraft are being fitted with the system.

    The IAF at present operates six IL-78 planes for air-to-air refuelling and has a requirement for more. Incidentally, in 2016, India had scrapped a deal for acquisition of six Airbus A-330 mid-air refuelling aircraft.

    The indigenous AWACS have a 240 degree scanning capability, which means it scans the area on both sides, but not in the front or back.

    The new system being developed by DRDO would have AESA (active electronically scanned array) radars with 360 degree capability, which can detect incoming aerial threats like hostile fighters, drones and cruise missiles from 400-km away. India will be only the second country in the world after Israel to develop such a system.

    The new system is scheduled to be ready in seven years.

  5. #665
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    And there's more drama in the Mmrca competition.
    Looks like Eurofighter GmbH wants to have its revenge and re enter the Mmrca competition, the upcoming twin engined one.

    Exactly how was Airbus defense and space able to quote a price of 59 million € per jet for 126+63 Typhoons which also includes license production by HAL is beyond me.


    https://theprint.in/2017/12/01/rafal...r-eurofighter/

    New Delhi: Months before it signed the deal to buy 36 Rafale fighter jets from France in 2016, the NDA government passed over another European offer that promised deliveries of the Eurofighter Typhoon combat aircraft which was €59 million (Rs 453 cr) per unit cheaper than the French planes.

    The offer – made at the top level of the Indian government – involved diverting deliveries of Eurofighter Typhoon jets from Britain, Italy and Germany to meet urgent Indian requirements. The offer also pledged to set up a full production line for transfer of technology of the combat jets. (Read full letter)

    The offer of the Eurofighter Typhoon, manufactured by a consortium of European firms, was pushed by both Germany and Britain at the most senior levels.

    The price: €138 million per unit for 126 Eurofighter Typhoon aircraft against the €197 million for each of the 36 Rafale jets New Delhi agreed to buy from Paris.

    Both prices do not include the cost of weapons. India has to pay another €710 million for missiles that come with the Rafale. The cost of weapons for the Eurofighter Typhoon were not discussed as the offer was not pursued.

    A graphic showing the comparison between the Eurofighter Typhoon jet and Dassault Rafale jet

    In fairness, the Eurofighter Typhoon offer was for the larger order of 126 jets involving better economies of scale. The price for 36 flyaway jets was not discussed as India did not engage in detailed talks with the consortium.

    Earlier this month, the opposition Congress party alleged a “huge scam” in the Rafale deal, raising questions about the cost of the fighter jet and the procurement procedure that was followed. The Congress claims it had negotiated a lower price for the same Rafale jets.

    The Congress also accused the government of promoting the financial interests of its “crony capitalist friends” at the cost of a defence public sector unit, calling into question a large part of the offsets being executed by Dassault Reliance Aerospace Limited.

    The NDA government has denied any wrongdoing in the deal. Defence minister Nirmala Sitharaman has said that the situation in the Air Force was grim when the alliance took power in 2014 and blamed it on what she said was inaction by the previous UPA government.

    Prime Minister Narendra Modi’s government had to move quickly on the Rafale deal to ensure the Air Force was not left unattended, she had said.

    Reliance Aerospace has said that it had no role to play in the selection of the fighter and is only an offset partner to make parts for executive jets and other products.

    ‘Clear signal’ in favour of Rafale

    Back in 2012, both the French Rafale and the Eurofighter Typhoon had been found compliant to all India-specific requirements by the Air Force. Other aircraft such as the F-16, Gripen and F/A-18 had been rejected after a series of tests. Negotiations started with Rafale due to the lower price offered then.

    “Out of the six proposals received in response to the RFP for procurement of the MMRCA, the proposals of M/s Dassault Aviation for Rafale and M/s EADS, Germany for Eurofighter Typhoon were found compliant to the technical requirements. The proposal of M/s Dassault Aviation had the lowest cost,” then defence minister Arun Jaitley had told the Lok Sabha in August 2014.

    After it became clear that the UPA-led process to purchase the Rafale was getting delayed, the Modi government was forced to scrap it in favour of a fresh deal. Sensing a fresh opportunity, Germany, strongly backed by Britain, made a new bid and offered a 20 per cent reduction in Eurofighter Typhoon prices for India.

    This offer was first made in July 2014 and was valid through 2015 when New Delhi was negotiating the Rafale deal.

    Also read: The turbulent history of the Rafale deal

    Several sources involved in the process told ThePrint that while a patient hearing was given initially to Eurofighter, a clear signal came from South Block that only the Rafale was being considered.

    Also, unlike the process followed with France, where several options on numbers and capabilities were discussed, talks with Germany and Britain did not go beyond a paper proposal.

    The Eurofighter Typhoon had been offered at a total cost of €17.5 billion for 126 fighters, or €138 million per plane.

    The Rafale deal cost India €7.1 billion for 36 jets, which translates to €197 million per jet.

    Even if the €353 million performance based logistics cost – the money to maintain and fly the fighters for five years – is deducted, the Rafale jets cost India €187 million per fighter.

    Promise to transfer technology

    The German deal also promised technology transfer to manufacture the jets in India. “The alliance of Indian companies with the Eurofighter Typhoon program will have a comparable impact on employment and create more than 20,000 jobs for highly skilled employees in India,” the formal proposal read.

    The Rafale jet deal that was finally signed in 2016 did not include the requirement of manufacturing the jets in India, likely due to the limited number of 36 aircraft ordered. While this number is expected to go up, the deal only has a clause that 50 per cent of the contract value will be invested in India. The lead Indian company chosen for this offset clause is Dassault Reliance Aerospace Limited.

    The Germans also offered to divert current orders in case India required the jets on an urgent basis.

    “To further accelerate the availability of fighter aircraft for the government of India we are in dialogue with our European customer nations Germany, United Kingdom, Italy and Spain to divert from their own deliveries to the benefit of the Government of India should you wish to utilize such an accelerated program,” the offer said.

    Sources said that India did not get into detailed discussions about the per unit price of the Eurofighter in the event New Delhi reduced the number of jets it planned to order as it eventually happened with the Rafale.

    “It was clear that discussions would only be carried on with the French and there was no room for any other offer,” an official, who had been involved in the discussions, told ThePrint.

    India is due to get 36 Rafale jets by the end of 2019 – a much needed addition to the Air Force that is desperate for cutting edge fighters. The Air Force is also keen to add to this fleet with more orders, given the unreliability of the existing Russian fleet and delays in inducting the indigenous Tejas.

    https://theprint.in/2017/12/01/lette...t-eurofighter/

    This will add a whole new dimension to the ongoing fiasco.

  6. #666
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    After it became clear that the UPA-led process to purchase the Rafale was getting delayed, the Modi government was forced to scrap it in favour of a fresh deal. Sensing a fresh opportunity, Germany, strongly backed by Britain, made a new bid and offered a 20 per cent reduction in Eurofighter Typhoon prices for India.
    If this report is correct about Eurofighter coming back with a 20% price cut, I'm baffled as to why Eurofighter did not quote a lower price when selected as one of the 2 qualifying suppliers. They could/would have won the competition if they had done that to achieve a lower L1 number than Dassault.
    Sum ergo cogito

  7. #667
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    The letter from Head of military aircraft, Airbus Defense and Space to Raksha Mantri, MoD regarding the Eurofighter Typhoon offer.



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    Last edited by Arihant; 1st December 2017 at 16:10.

  8. #668
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    NEW DELHI: The next-generation airborne early warning and control system (AWACS), with a 360-degree scan being developed by the DRDO, would also double up as an air-to-air refueller following a request by the Indian Air Force (IAF), according to a top DRDOofficial.
    these people are truly in lala land. There is no evidence that Airbus can put 11 meter dish and with all radiation strengthening into A330. I am not going into big wingtip and tail pods. and so much stuff into nose that will reduce its range alot. it will need long run way just to lift. plus sharing cockpit with commercial airlines means experience pilot retention and maintainance crew will get expensive.

  9. #669
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    Airbus is desperate to kill the Rafale deal.. why not just give the Typhoon away for free while they are at it?

    They had a fair chance to bid, they were supposed to give their best offer.. they were way above what they propose now.. but if India breaks a deal on "late" offer, it gives nice material for a lawsuit that may just as well make them be in position to pay more than the Rafale deal even if the Airbus offer was only half serious...

  10. #670
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    Airbus is desperate to kill the Rafale deal.. why not just give the Typhoon away for free while they are at it?
    It is far too late to kill the Rafale deal IMO.

    They had a fair chance to bid, they were supposed to give their best offer.. they were way above what they propose now.. but if India breaks a deal on "late" offer, it gives nice material for a lawsuit that may just as well make them be in position to pay more than the Rafale deal even if the Airbus offer was only half serious...
    IMO Eurofighter tried to get far more profit than they needed to make the deal give them an acceptable return and Rafale won on a cost basis. If Eurofighter had reduced their quoted price substantially soon after losing the F1 assessment it might just have been possible to get India to reconsider Typhoon. That did not happen. I think that Eurofighter have ended up with nothing due to simple greed.

    If I go to a souk to buy a carpet from one of two merchants, tell both that I will decide which I want to buy based on the best price they can offer me then if one does not give me his best price and consequently I decide to buy from the other, the loser has only himself to blame. Trying to drag me back into his shop offering me 20% off his last price after I have done a deal with the other carpet seller and paid him some of the cost is not going to work.
    Sum ergo cogito

  11. #671
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    thing is, when India declared Rafale as winner on costs, the British jumped in immediately saying that they could make a better offer (it was the Germans who were in charge of India's MMRCA contract).

    Anyway, you're right: the basic rule is that everybody has to make his best offer as nobody knows what price others have asked for. Date and time are precisely set and no offer is acceptable after that point. So, any change in offered price after that moment is simply void. What we see now is the campaign from Eurofighter group trying eventually to sell its fighter there anyway combined with political clout raised by Modi's opposition who obviously has no solid argument against him and tries whatever they can to discredit him and his government
    Last edited by TooCool_12f; 3rd December 2017 at 11:09.

  12. #672
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    Apparently the Akash missile tests carried out last week were for a new variant called Akash S1. This one has a seeker.

  13. #673
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    Yep you are right Twin blade.
    The series of 5 launches done by the Army on Thursday featured the new Akash with a seeker.

    Today for the first time, Akash was tested with an indigenous RF seeker by DRDO.

    http://googleweblight.com/i?u=http:/...Ah0d4o-QPKFSqb

    Successful Launch of Akash Missile


    The Surface to Air Missile AKASH with indigenous radio frequency seeker against target Banshee, has been successfully launched from the Launch Complex-III at ITR Chandipur today at 1338 hrs. The Radars, telemetry and electro-optical systems along the coast have tracked and monitored all the health parameters of the missile. The launch operations were witnessed by
    Director General (Missiles), DRDO and Scientific Adviser to Raksha Mantri (SA to RM) Dr. G Satheesh Reddy; Director DRDL, Shri MSR Prasad; Program Director, Shri G Chandra Mouli; Director ITR, Dr. BK Das and other top DRDO scientists.
    SA to RM congratulated all the DRDO scientists and Armed Forces for this success.

    This missile is being inducted into Army as Short Range Surface to Air Missile (SRSAM). This is the first Surface to Air Missile with indigenous seeker that has been test fired. With this success, India has achieved the capability of making any type of Surface to Air Missile.
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    The Akash SAM program alone goes to show the importance of indigenisation. An order that size for a foreign SAM would've cost several billions of $ flowing out of the country. Now, DRDO can continously improve the Akash and produce new variants like this new seeker equipped Akash and the in development Akash Mk2 with the longer range. A very cost effective solution and one of the most marketable Indian defence products for exports.

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    Tweet by Saurav Jha on the Akash NG SAM that is under development.


    If you think the Akash Mk-1S upgrade has been a long time coming, wait till you see @DRDO_India's Akash NG with an active RF seeker, laser proximity fuse and dual pulse solid propulsion and near 50 km max range
    Twitter link

  16. #676
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    The letter from Head of military aircraft, Airbus Defense and Space to Raksha Mantri, MoD regarding the Eurofighter Typhoon offer.
    Sweet M...

    Why the bloody idiots didnt made that offer while during the competition?!

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    Indian startup developing High Altitude Pseudo Satellite


  18. #678
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    High altitude long endurance would be right term instead of near earth orbit , never heard of that term before

    Global hawk like UAV would be a good addition to ARC fleet
    "A map does you no good if you don't know where you are"

  19. #679
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    Quote Originally Posted by Spitfire9
    If I go to a souk to buy a carpet from one of two merchants, tell both that I will decide which I want to buy based on the best price they can offer me then if one does not give me his best price and consequently I decide to buy from the other, the loser has only himself to blame. Trying to drag me back into his shop offering me 20% off his last price after I have done a deal with the other carpet seller and paid him some of the cost is not going to work.
    Not quite. The letter is dated 2014 i.e. two years after the Rafale was declared L1, at a time when the negotiations had practically come to a standstill but a year before the MoU for an off-the-shelf order was signed.

    So its more like the loser trying to drag you back to his shop after you've been coming to the winner's shop every day for two weeks without being able to settle on a price, with your guide/driver whispering in your ear that the offer may not be the cheapest once the taxes, packaging, transportation & service charges were included.

  20. #680
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    @Vnomad

    Good continuation of the metaphor to me. Understood.
    Sum ergo cogito

  21. #681
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    India's Rudra ALHs back in sight- still awaiting ATGMs

    India’s HAL Rudra armed helicopters have had an unusually low profile since they entered service four years ago. Handed over to the Indian Army with great fanfare in 2013, they’ve melted quietly into operational service, never really showing themselves again since. Which is why, it was a pleasant surprise when a Rudra popped up in photographs of India’s new defence minister Nirmala Sitharaman on a visit to the IAF’s Naliya air force base in western India. The minister, accompanied by Army chief General Bipin Rawat was specifically given a 15-minute tour of the Rudra by an Army Aviation Corps. pilot apparently in keeping with her professed focus on modernisation with a focus on indigenous products.

    HAL’s Rudra, a weaponised and hunt-focused Mk.4 version of the trusty Dhruv, is still settling in with its primary customer — the Indian Army signed on earlier this month for 18 more, taking the total size of its intended fleet to 78 aircraft. The Army currently 23 Rudras across three operational squadrons, with plans to raise four more squadrons. A further 21 airframes are currently under test at HAL Bengaluru. HAL will produce a total of 34 more Rudras to complete the Army’s current confirmed order book of 78. More from Defence Minister Sitharaman’s tour of a Rudra at AFS Naliya:

    While the Army is largely pleased with the Rudra, save some niggles being sorted out with HAL, a serious unresolved flashpoint between the Indian Army and the copter remains its lack of an anti-tank guided missile. India continues to stall on a decision to award a contract for 124 launchers and 1,362 missiles to either MBDA or Rafael Defence for the PARS L3 or Spike ER respectively. The indigenous HELINA ATGM is still at least two years away from proving itself on the Rudra’s launchers. Livefist can confirm that Minister Sitharaman has been brought up to speed on the Rudra’s pecular ‘armed-but-weaponless’ situation and moving forward on a decision will be one of the things on her table soon.

    Official HAL literature on the Rudra details the platform thus:

    The Rudra can deploy 48 70mm rockets at standoff ranges of more than 8 km, a turret mounted 20 mm cannon cued to its electro optical payload or the pilot’s helmet mounted cuing system. This provides Rudra immediate and accurate firepower against ground and aerial targets. Pilot only has to look at the target and fire. With an advanced ballistic computer, the guns are very accurate even at extreme angles. Fire and forget anti-tank guided missiles with 7-km range make Rudra an ideal platform for ground support roles. Rudra can carry four air to air missiles. These are infra red guided fire and forget missiles with off axis boresight capability. Pilot can engage the target using the helmet mounted sight or with the electro optical pod, while manoeuvering. State of the art sensors complement this tremendous firepower. Gyrostabilised electro optical sensors work on both visual and IR spectrum. Any type of target will be picked up and tracked at large distances, whether by day or by night. These targets can be handed over to the guided missiles or attacked with rockets and gun. The laser designator can designate the target for any compatible weapon. A comprehensive self protection suite would empower the pilot with essential situational awareness of the elctromagnetic and laser environment.
    Certainly not "armed but weaponless" since it has its cannon and rockets, but it is lacking the ATGM that will give it the most offensive punch against armoured threats. Perhaps a small order for PARS3 or Spike ER or Hellfire to keep the fleet armed with an ATGM till the Helina enters service will be the way to go. It doesn't make sense to hand over hundreds of millions of $ to import something that DRDO is very close to be being able to indigenously design and produce.




  22. #682
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    NEW DELHI — The upgrade of India’s Mirage 2000-H fleet could face a roadblock, after the maintenance warranty from original equipment manufacturers Dassault Aviation and Thales of France expired with nobody willing to continue footing the bill.

    The two companies are demanding an annual maintenance fee of around $15 million from state-owned Hindustan Aeronautics Ltd, the prime contractor on the upgrade, to extend the tooling & test machinery and equipment warranty that expired last month. HAL is refusing to pay, instead asking Indian Air Force to make the payments; IAF argues however that the annual maintenance fee is part the upgrade contract with HAL.
    https://www.defensenews.com/global/a...ntracts-lapse/

    This could not be sorted out before the deadline passed?
    Last edited by Spitfire9; 8th December 2017 at 16:05.
    Sum ergo cogito

  23. #683
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    @VNomad:

    Regarding the Maintenance hour and manpower cost, you are right that a straightforward comparison can be made with the RAF. Daily work hours are at the same level in both countries (max permissible number of hours) resulting only in adjustment (ratio) to be made on the end-cost.
    Comparing maintenance total time b/w Germany and UK might also result in additional information.

    Regarding the Rafale, Eagle1 is correct emphasizing the history of MDBA to build planes with minimal maintenance needs . This is a result of years of dev with a single major customer and the progressive iterative implementation of new tech (just like Mig in Russia). This however leads also to some huge step being made to narrow the gap with other products introducing new technologies that have to be matched one way or another. RCS coating* is one major example on the Rafale, something highly maintenance incentive the way it was implemented on the aircraft**.

    So, at the end, it would be difficult to guess with a serious level of precision what are those values without any source from the users.


    *But think also heavier wing structure and lower engine power resulting in added wear on the engine or smaller nose cone that necessitate more tricky/higher tech radar system, produced at a lower scale, prone to a higher level of failure (thermal induced or other).
    ** see the video that I posted here with a mechanics having to work all the night alone on the aircraft to correct the thickness of the patched coating following a birdstrike on one Rafale
    Last edited by TomcatViP; 8th December 2017 at 20:35.

  24. #684
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    @TomcatVIP


    ** see the video that I posted here with a mechanics having to work all the night alone on the aircraft to correct the thickness of the patched coating following a birdstrike on one Rafale
    Can you post the link here? I am unable to find your video.

    And regarding RAM coating on the Rafale, is the entire aircraft coated with Ram? Or are the leading and trailing edges of the wings and intakes only ram coated?

    Tomcat, can you give me some links on the RCS reduction features and ram coatings of the Rafale. I have heard many a times that the Raf incorporates comprehensive RCS reduction features but haven't come across an article which provides a detailed insight into this.

  25. #685
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    AESA was an integral part of the J-10B design with the pics of it installed hitting the net around 2011. The APG-63v2 & APG-81 are irrelevant since the comparison was with the Bars.
    Aesa was never an integral part of J-10B.pesa was. The supposed aesa on the B feature IFF antenna and I haven't come across any aesa which sports the same. It was the J-10C which sports an aesa.

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    Pesa onboard J-10B

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    This is the aesa

    I made the comparison because you were of the opinion that Chinese aesa were having the same features and performance specs as their European and American counterparts. I fail to comprehend how an institute which has just ventured into the field of aesa can come up with a product which matches the performance and specs of American aesa radars from firms who have been in this field for the past 30-40 years. It's as if the Chinese radar institutes have suddenly accumulated the vast experience and knowledge of Raytheon, Lockheed, Northrop Grumman, Thales and are as technically competent. Phew. I guess the Chinese aesas on the J-10C, J-16 and J-11C at best matches the specs of the initial Phazotron FGA-28 aesa of 2007 vintage.

    I've had 'frank conversations' with probably as many Indians as you, maybe more, depending on our age difference.

    And dragging two other posters (not to mention an entire nation) your racial stereotyping exercise doesn't make it anymore valid. Yes a lot of cheap crap comes out of China, so does a lot of well engineering stuff (a lot of which is very popular in India as well, eg. Xiaomi Note 4). With a 22% share in the world's manufacturing output, that's pretty much inevitable.
    This is the best part. I have had infinitesimally less no of frank conversations with fellow Indians compared to you despite the fact that I am an Indian and you are not.

    I am not dragging two other posters and my other fellow Indians. I was just saying those two are too polite to speak out their mind. Neither was I indulging in racial stereotyping. I have enough respect for the Hans. There are lots of things that we Indians and even rest of the world needs to learn from the Chinese.

    But I will stick to my point of the rather inferior quality of Chinese products. Yes, mobiles from Chinese companies are best sellers in India as well as a lot of other Chinese stuffs. It's because they are cheap. And most of the stuff that goes into a cell phone from MII or Redmi aren't Chinese designed. Processors from Qualcomm and Snapdragon, the GPU and even the Ram, these aren't Chinese. Most of the components are from other OEM. These out sell most other phones in India because they are affordable and they pack quite a bang for their price. They are great. And other brands can hardly match them.

    But if you say, KLJ-7A and other Chinese aesa a are great, that you guys will produce a photonic radar by the early 2020s,that you are a world leader in ghost imaging technology, that Chinese ew and ecm tech have no parallel in the world, then I have my apprehensions.

  26. #686
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    Aug 2011
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    4,709
    Processors from Qualcomm and Snapdragon, the GPU and even the Ram, these aren't Chinese.
    yup those fabless firms like Qualcomm can survive without Chinese foundries. China is ordering $70b worth of fab equipment for manufacturing thats on top of hundreds billions already spent. Chinese still send the highest number of engineering students to best universities in world.
    that AESA radar tech is isnt that advanced compared to cellular phones or supercomputers.

    https://www.qualcomm.com/news/releas...oduction-china
    SMIC and Qualcomm Collaborate on 28nm Wafer Production in China
    This collaboration will help accelerate SMIC’s 28nm process maturity and capacity, and will also make SMIC one of the first semiconductor foundries in China to offer production locally for some of Qualcomm Technologies’ latest Snapdragon processors on 28nm node, both PolySiON (PS) and high-K dielectrics metal gate (HKMG).

  27. #687
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    @pussycatVIP

    So the Rafale is very maintenance intensive because it takes the whole night to repair the RAM coating after a bird strike? Is that really your point?

    Also how does lower engine power result in more stress on the engine when the plane is lighter & TW ratio is very similar? Maybe you have actual figures to provide to make a comparison on engine life cycle?

    Nic
    Last edited by Nicolas10; 9th December 2017 at 11:24.

  28. #688
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    Sorry Arihant, I have to check my archive. Didn't find it searching youtube. But maybe the above individual might help you.

    Meanwhile, I found this one: HAL projected Rafale manufacturing facility:


  29. #689
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    May 2005
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    RCS reduction measures are classified. The sawtooth edges are only the visible part of it. The general idea was to design the plane in order to concentrate the RCS spikes on a few spots on the aircraft, and then treat those spots with RAMs and other measures (active or passive).

    BTW the music in that last video is even worse than that on russian vids.

    Nic
    Last edited by Nicolas10; 9th December 2017 at 11:34.

  30. #690
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    Quote Originally Posted by TomcatViP
    Sorry Arihant, I have to check my archive.
    How convenient ! Keep trolling...

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