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Thread: Stirling 3D/4D Model

  1. #31
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    I supplied some bits to help restore the only surviving FN25 when it was being restored by restorations unlimited...it was put on display for the day and I went up and did a few 35mm shots.It was a bit dark so I don't know how clear the internal shots are.I will try and locate them over the holiday for you!!
    `Information is the currency of democracy`. Thomas Jefferson

  2. #32
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    Quote Originally Posted by hindenburg View Post
    I supplied some bits to help restore the only surviving FN25 when it was being restored by restorations unlimited...it was put on display for the day and I went up and did a few 35mm shots.It was a bit dark so I don't know how clear the internal shots are.I will try and locate them over the holiday for you!!
    Phew! Lucky you! They would be superb, it's the same Turret in the FlyPast article obviously, Whatever you have will help!

    I hope thet the turret is around somewhere still and that one day it will emerge into the daylight.



    James

  3. #33
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    No,these are photos I took myself James.
    `Information is the currency of democracy`. Thomas Jefferson

  4. #34
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    Hi All

    Finally I've completed the ammo belt animation of the FN25 turret! The rest will be finished soon!


    https://youtu.be/OfHjDMIvRTQ


    James

  5. #35
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    Out of interest...where di you get the info from to do all the labelling and control panel layout??? It's spot on,and there's not a lot of info on FN 25s out there.!!
    `Information is the currency of democracy`. Thomas Jefferson

  6. #36
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    Click image for larger version. 

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ID:	242950 I found all the photos..not brilliant light wise as my camera flash packed in that day.I'll take them in to work and scan them for you.They're a lot more in focus than this I might add..took this in a badly lit kitchen with the iPad!!!!
    `Information is the currency of democracy`. Thomas Jefferson

  7. #37
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    Quote Originally Posted by hindenburg View Post
    Out of interest...where di you get the info from to do all the labelling and control panel layout??? It's spot on,and there's not a lot of info on FN 25s out there.!!
    Hi Hindenburg

    Thank heaven for the Aircraft Publications, so helpful, along with the fact that I can simply 'trace' any drawing with my 3D program meaning that the result can be fairly accurate (but are generally always wrong in fact - but not by much). These from AP1659A Frazer-Nash Gun Turrets.

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    Also thank heaven that the RAFM have thousands of these A.P.s - for me its a problem to get there but worth it.

    I read that the chaps at the Restoration company you mentioned couldn't work out the electrical wiring (there's none coming out of their Rotating Joint) that seems odd given that the wiring is clear from the AP and you can see it on the attached pics. The AP reveals a great deal of info, if you happen to have a turret to restore.

    I've also developed a 'font' which closely resembles that used on the Stirling, that helps too.

    James
    Last edited by jamesinnewcastl; 2nd January 2016 at 18:45.

  8. #38
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    Wow..that's interesting...do you mind if I use these images in the Turret section of my Stirling bits page ???
    `Information is the currency of democracy`. Thomas Jefferson

  9. #39
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ID:	242997looks good to me..again I'll scan these properly for you.Wonder where this turret ended up in the end?????
    Last edited by hindenburg; 3rd January 2016 at 15:15.
    `Information is the currency of democracy`. Thomas Jefferson

  10. #40
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    Quote Originally Posted by hindenburg View Post
    Wow..that's interesting...do you mind if I use these images in the Turret section of my Stirling bits page ???
    Not at all, these are from the RAFM copy.

    Looking forward to your pics too.


    James
    Last edited by jamesinnewcastl; 3rd January 2016 at 17:44.

  11. #41
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    Thank you James....
    `Information is the currency of democracy`. Thomas Jefferson

  12. #42
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    Hi Hindenburg

    Here's another snippet for the FN25, it contains actual measurements!

    Interestingly the turret is tilted from the vertical (assuming that the floor is horizontal), makes you wonder if this was corrected by the apparent 'nose up' flight angle of the Stirling.


    James
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    Last edited by jamesinnewcastl; 5th January 2016 at 11:27.

  13. #43
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    And using those dimensions - into the fuselage she goes! Still need to fiddle a good few parts

    I hope to show that perhaps these turrets may not deserve the 'always sliding out of the fuselage' reputation that they have.


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    James
    Last edited by jamesinnewcastl; 6th January 2016 at 00:11.

  14. #44
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    Wonderful...if only the real thing were so easy.I tried filling in the gaps between measurements and drawings with the brother-in-law doing the layout on the computer.The panel resulting from this would' fit it's space and the curve was wrong.The only reason he could come up with is the computer and human are different as far as the curve was not constant for a reason..and the instrument sizes must vary slightly where as his computer filled in the gaps logically...no..I don't know what he meant either.
    `Information is the currency of democracy`. Thomas Jefferson

  15. #45
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    Quote Originally Posted by hindenburg View Post
    Wonderful...if only the real thing were so easy.
    Easy? Blooming Cheek!

    I don't have many drawings, and fewer actual dimensions, photos are useful but can be incredibly misleading. I do have to jiggle and jostle the parts together for ages but at the end I still know that it's still mostly wrong. As you know the A/C changed constantly in detail which doesn't help!

    Still it's very absorbing and I'm enjoying the results!


    James

  16. #46
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    Click image for larger version. 

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    Hi All

    I've never seen a really good picture of the underside of a Stirling but modelling it is revealing what may have been there.

    Here is a comparison of the best MkI underside pic I have and a comparison with the model. The tail or fin is quite distinct and a common sight, the two black dots could be where the spent cartridges fall out - might be the gun barrel ends? The bottom of the footwell is less distinct but you can sort of imagine it.

    The black crescent defining the far section of the turret apeture is quite deep and shows that the turret was not 'flush' - the original photo must have been lit from below to produce this effect - that probably wasn't a common lighting arrangement I wouldn't have thought.

    James

  17. #47
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    So this is what it looks like close up - possibly the gaps were plated over but it would have been a complex piece of work. Unlike other dustbin turrets the FN25 doesn't have a big flange to act as a cover

    The turret drops through a circular 'I-girder' and so the oddly eccentric positioning must have been how it was. The shadow on the photo shows that the plating wasn't flush which seems to be asking for 'drag'. However, the girder seems to actually be two similar girders, one on top of the other so there would have been somewhere to put some plating and have a recess.

    Taking votes on the plating - or not!

    James
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  18. #48
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    Some images of the FN25 installation and pipework.
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  19. #49
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    more shots
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  20. #50
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    a few more.... Video to follow
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  21. #51
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    Hi

    As promised this is a link to an animation of the FN25. I don't think that this was ever filmed.

    https://youtu.be/RUBqaqqvk2o



    James

  22. #52
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    This animation shows what it was like to be a gunner in the FN25. Still loads of work to do on the texturing - but that's for later.

    It's very hard to reproduce what you would actually see - It's interesting to note that human eyes can see through more than 180 degrees and in fact the edges of your vision is the shape of a big oval! Your vision is only limited by your skull! So I've widened the field of view to try and get to a human view, agaian getting that closer will be for later.

    https://youtu.be/halriSTAii0


    Cheers
    James

  23. #53
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ID:	244517 looking fantastic James...as regards dimensions,I have some bomb door parts if you need and shapes or measurements.
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    `Information is the currency of democracy`. Thomas Jefferson

  24. #54
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    Hi Hindenburg

    Thanks for the offer, I've got the bomb doors pretty much in place now, next items are the roof emergency hatch, and the rear gun ammo runs, the escape ladder and that ood step thingy for the crew to exit from the Astrodome - dimensions of parts of that would be great!

    Cheers
    James

  25. #55
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    Incredible work James!!
    Mike

  26. #56
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    Thanks Turretboy

    Next set of images will be a walk up the back of the Stirling to see the many holes and items too hard to see on the grainy pics of that period.


    James

  27. #57
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    MkI - Mid Upper ladder pulled forward and pivoted down - hatch has been opened by the external handles held under the door in the fuselage next to the hatch.

    Nice day - crew off for a walk I guess!


    James
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  28. #58
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    Any updates James??
    `Information is the currency of democracy`. Thomas Jefferson

  29. #59
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    Quote Originally Posted by hindenburg View Post
    Any updates James??
    Hi Martin

    I've been diverted a lot by damp in a friends house and other building work - but I made a good fist of some new flashing I am pleased to say!

    Still working on a video showing all the holes along the top surface of the Stirling - met some issues with the way the modelling software smooths over the fuselage which involves a lot of 'fiddling' to get smooth.

    Added a request to you on your facebook page for some dimensions

    Cheers
    James

  30. #60
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    This is extraordinary - very well done James - a work of art and engineering.

    If you don't mind me asking, how is this done? What software etc? You talk about being able to trace diagrams/plans? Surely they are 2D?

    Many thanks, Don
    never fear, Smith is here

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