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Thread: Wyvern burials - Gosport

  1. #61
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    Thats the one Mark thank you . Shame the serial is still not obvious but i have a pretty good idea which one it is, as it sheared its entire engine off whilst taxiing through turbine failure.

  2. #62
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    Quote Originally Posted by Wyvernfan View Post
    Thats the one Mark thank you . Shame the serial is still not obvious but i have a pretty good idea which one it is, as it sheared its entire engine off whilst taxiing through turbine failure.
    This little side trip to Gosport was a bonus after the Lee on Sea Navy Day. My pal's father had driven us down from Wembley and I remember that I was reasonably well attired, blazer etc and but for that a fence of those proportions would not normally have been a deterrent to getting better and closer individual photographs.

    Mark
    "...the story had been forensically examined and was deeply impressive. I knew that the whole story was a load of myth and baloney…"

  3. #63
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mark12 View Post
    Could that be your Master/Martinet back end behind this Firefly?
    I would say yes, isn't that the Attacker back end, prominant in your earlier shot, just behind it? You can just make out the tailplane up at an angle (immediate right of the skinless Martinet ? rudder) with the elevator horn balance sticking up.

    Interesting set of pictures as you can just about work out the relative positions of the aircraft.

  4. #64
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    Martinet rudder appears a good shout

    Regards,

    Tim
    Attached Images Attached Images  

  5. #65
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    Quote Originally Posted by Roborough View Post
    I have a vague recollection of there being an early Wyvern in the Scrapyard at RNAY Fleetlands around 1958. Definitely not an S4, there were a few of them still trickling through the shops as late as 1958. The scrapyard was I believe cleared in the early '60s to make room for the Helipad (or possibly the new apprentice training centre).
    I worked at Fleetlands from 1957 - 63 and I think the yard had been cleared by the time I left.
    Does anyone know if Fleetlands will survive the current round of defence cuts?

    Regards
    Bill
    The Sale Pound eventually made way for L Hangar (the Chinook hangar). Many an interesting type went through there - there are photos of a complete Firefly T.2, a dismantled Attacker, complete Meteor TT.20, Sea Hawks.....you name it. Not to mention the boxes of zero-houred Griffon 74s and Centaurus 18s (as late as 1968). Even the famous Portsmouth Civil Defence Wildcat was noted there in late 1962.

    I'm just looking at the complete (with wiring loom) control grip from Scimitar XD218 which was salvaged by a late friend of mine who 'was sent to rob it for F Shop'......sadly the pitot tube he also 'had to get' couldn't be secreted apon his person sufficiently well whilst leaving the Yard on a pushbike, so it eventually got scrapped.

    Mark - never mind the Seafang, what we need is a time machine!
    The views I express are PURELY my own. Please respect that.

  6. #66
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    Incidentally the Firefly AS.5 '230' should be WB379 ('230/K'), formerly of 816 Squadron and latterly in use as a GI airframe with the SAH at Gosport.

    Can't help with any Martinet serial though (if, of course, that is what it is). Sure it's not a Firefly FR.1 (examples of which were definitely dumped there too)?
    The views I express are PURELY my own. Please respect that.

  7. #67
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    Quote Originally Posted by Wyvernfan View Post
    Roborough - After a quick check the only one i can find that ended up being scrapped at Fleetlands was TF.2 VW876. This came from Farnborough after a wheels up landing there.
    Thanks Wyvernfan
    I wish I'd noted all of this stuff at the time. There were some interesting relics in the scrapyard at that time including one of the Blackburn prototypes that competed with the Gannet, and a couple of long surviving Sea hornets.
    Regards
    Bill

  8. #68
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    I'm just looking at the complete (with wiring loom) control grip from Scimitar XD218 which was salvaged by a late friend of mine who 'was sent to rob it for F Shop'......sadly the pitot tube he also 'had to get' couldn't be secreted apon his person sufficiently well whilst leaving the Yard on a pushbike, so it eventually got scrapped.

    Hi Lee:

    Sorry for the thread drift... I worked on Scimitars in F shop for about 6 months as part of the 4th year apprentice shop tour, and I still have the nightmares! Being covered in the gunk that was used to seal the rivets in the wet wing tanks was just one. But, like the S4 Wyvern the Scimitar was a superb looking beast.
    Regards
    Bill

  9. #69
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    Quote Originally Posted by Lee Howard View Post
    Can't help with any Martinet serial though (if, of course, that is what it is). Sure it's not a Firefly FR.1 (examples of which were definitely dumped there too)?
    Surprising how similar the two tail profiles are, what errs it on the side for Martinet for me is the tail plane positioning seems to far aft for the Firefly, (Martinet elevators come aft of the rudder hinge line) but maybe that is a trick of the angle it was taken at?

  10. #70
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    Is this the TF2

    The fuselage of Flt Lt Stotons Wyvern TF2

  11. #71
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    Flt Lt Stoton's mishap!

    FLT LT Stoton stands in front of the remains of the Python one engine and props

    Flt Lt Stoton stands in front of the remains of the Python 1 engine and Props that became detached after a turbine failure sheared through the airfame. The aircraft was re-built after this incident, could this be the airframe in the compound?

  12. #72
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    "All my own work"

    or perhaps

    "Here's one I made earlier".

    If you are going to have engine problem, you might as well do it thoroughly!

    Adrian
    "Snow clearing equipment has been found under snowdrift" - message sent from RNAS Hatston, Orkney, 1944.

  13. #73
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    Quote Originally Posted by pagen01 View Post
    Surprising how similar the two tail profiles are, what errs it on the side for Martinet for me is the tail plane positioning seems to far aft for the Firefly, (Martinet elevators come aft of the rudder hinge line) but maybe that is a trick of the angle it was taken at?
    Definatly Firefly.
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  14. #74
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    Hi Ollie, as we've discussed before i'm pretty sure that they are the same Wyvern (my moneys on VW871), as Mark12's photo shows a TF.2 with what appears to be new cowlings and panels from the engine bulkhead forward. If not then its a strange coincidence.

    Also interesting to note another Wyvern with wings folded to the far right in your engineless pic.

  15. #75
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    HMS Siskin Dispersal

    Photobucket

    Sea Balliol, Wyvern S4 and a Seahawk parked at the Northern side of HMS Siskin's mainly grass airfield. The Wyvern's tasking was usually for the resident Aircraft Torpedo Development Unit, which on the closure of Siskin transferred to Culdrose in Cornwall.

  16. #76
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    Nice pic Ollie. Clearly thats a full blown S.4 and not a TF.2.! Any date when it was taken?

  17. #77
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    Sorry no date attached to the original, I just thought it worth posting as an indication of the variety of aircraft passing through Siskin. The museum on site has photos of just about every aircraft type you wish to mention. This is entirely due to the fact that Grange Field, RAF Grange, HMS Siskin and now HMS Sultan as it has been variously named has seen flying duties starting in 1909 until the present day.

  18. #78
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    Quote Originally Posted by ollie oliver View Post
    Photobucket

    Sea Balliol, Wyvern S4 and a Seahawk parked at the Northern side of HMS Siskin's mainly grass airfield. The Wyvern's tasking was usually for the resident Aircraft Torpedo Development Unit, which on the closure of Siskin transferred to Culdrose in Cornwall.
    Ollie

    It's not Siskin. That's Fleetlands (I have a copy of the photo). Date is 25 March 1958 and the Sea Balliol is 765 Sqn's WP325. It's the running-up pans opposite A and B Shops (where you lot used to park your trucks when you were with MASU!) looking across through the fence to Bedenham. The Wyvern is WN333 '382/O' (noting that if the date on which the photo was reportedly taken is correct the date in our book must be an allotment instead of an actual delivery; I'll amend!). I have a shot taken from the Sea Hawk end which shows the code on the Wyvern. Unfortunately the Sea Hawk is completely paint stripped, so no such ID for that one!

    Besides which Wyvern overhauls by Fleetlands only began in late 1956 - after Siskin closed - being test flown from Lee. Indeed there is a photo of one such machine - WN326 - on static display at Lee Air Day in 1957 just days before being flown to Lossiemouth and straight into storage prior to being scrapped. Fleetlands-overhauled aircraft (those that were refinished) were very easy to identify with a very deep EDSG demarcation line.

    MTP at that time was Lieutenant Commander (E) 'Joe' Norman who did (as far as I know) all of the Wyvern testing. I've only got part of his logbook (annoyingly missing March 1958!) and sadly he died last year.

    Lee
    Last edited by Lee Howard; 11th January 2012 at 23:14.

  19. #79
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    Quote Originally Posted by sopwith.7f1 View Post
    IF there are any remains of the Wyverns etc still there, then does it matter what condition they might be in ?. After all, how many of you would turn your noses up at a large lump of Spitfire, no matter how squashed, burned & corroded it might be ? "exactly, not many of you", so whats the difference if it's a lump of Wyvern, surely the chance of recovering any Wyvern parts is worth the effort, especially given the types rarety.

    Bob T.
    Some Spitfires have been rebuilt and flown with less material :diablo:

  20. #80
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    Quote Originally Posted by Lee Howard View Post
    Fleetlands-overhauled aircraft (those that were refinished) were very easy to identify with a very deep EDSG demarcation line.
    Ah, is that the reason for the demarcation discrepencies seen with Wyverns?

  21. #81
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    Quote Originally Posted by Lee Howard View Post
    Ollie

    It's not Siskin. That's Fleetlands (I have a copy of the photo). Date is 25 March 1958 and the Sea Balliol is 765 Sqn's WP325. It's the running-up pans opposite A and B Shops (where you lot used to park your trucks when you were with MASU!) looking across through the fence to Bedenham. The Wyvern is WN333 '382/O' (noting that if the date on which the photo was reportedly taken is correct the date in our book must be an allotment instead of an actual delivery; I'll amend!). I have a shot taken from the Sea Hawk end which shows the code on the Wyvern. Unfortunately the Sea Hawk is completely paint stripped, so no such ID for that one!

    Besides which Wyvern overhauls by Fleetlands only began in late 1956 - after Siskin closed - being test flown from Lee. Indeed there is a photo of one such machine - WN326 - on static display at Lee Air Day in 1957 just days before being flown to Lossiemouth and straight into storage prior to being scrapped. Fleetlands-overhauled aircraft (those that were refinished) were very easy to identify with a very deep EDSG demarcation line.

    MTP at that time was Lieutenant Commander (E) 'Joe' Norman who did (as far as I know) all of the Wyvern testing. I've only got part of his logbook (annoyingly missing March 1958!) and sadly he died last year.

    Lee
    I agree, It's Fleetlands. Just past B shop heading (north) towards the main part of the plant.

    Incidently many of the Wyverns arrived at Fleetlands still wearing their Suez stripes. Although the one in the pic is ex Ark Royal (not at Suez)

    A & B shops were converted to servicing helicopters shortly after this picture was taken. I have many happy memories of setting the rotor tracking out on those pads in the picture.
    Rgds
    Bill

  22. #82
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    Bill

    When were you at FL then? You're right; there are photos of Suez-marked Wyverns in H Shop (my old stomping ground) and similarly-marked Sea Hawks in B Shop. There is a photo of a Wyvern using the gun butts between A and B Shops (incredibly pointing right towards the A32!) and there is a photo of the tail of a Wyvern being inspected during a visit of (FORA, I think). But other than that, I can't think of any others.

    It's nice to go back and visit every few months but the old place is a shadow of its former glory. I'm only glad I got to experience it as a proper RNAY!

    Lee
    The views I express are PURELY my own. Please respect that.

  23. #83
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    Quote Originally Posted by trumper View Post
    Some Spitfires have been rebuilt and flown with less material :diablo:
    How much is a flying Wyvern worth up against a flying Spitfire ??
    Values after rebuild make a rebuild work...or not work.
    'Where the hell have you been?'

  24. #84
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    Quote Originally Posted by Lee Howard View Post
    Bill

    When were you at FL then? You're right; there are photos of Suez-marked Wyverns in H Shop (my old stomping ground) and similarly-marked Sea Hawks in B Shop. There is a photo of a Wyvern using the gun butts between A and B Shops (incredibly pointing right towards the A32!) and there is a photo of the tail of a Wyvern being inspected during a visit of (FORA, I think). But other than that, I can't think of any others.

    Out of interest where are these photos please?

  25. #85
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    Quote Originally Posted by xtangomike View Post
    How much is a flying Wyvern worth up against a flying Spitfire ??
    Values after rebuild make a rebuild work...or not work.
    Perhaps the question should be- How much is a flying Wyvern worth to the person who wants one, compared to how much a flying spitfire is worth to him ?.

    Bob T.

  26. #86
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    OOPS!

    Photobucket


    Thanks for the correction Lee. The photo with three a/c at dispersal appears in the Sultan Airfield museum stating it was Siskin, I will now be able to change this . Hopefully the attached Photo here is the one you mention as being Fleetlands.............?

  27. #87
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    Here is the other half of that photo.
    Last edited by H.M.S Vulture; 3rd October 2012 at 20:34.
    WANTED FAIREY FIREFLY parts!
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  28. #88
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    It doesn't surprise me that it was wrongly captioned. I recall there being many incorrectly captioned images on display there when it was run by my (sur)name sake!

    Yes, that's the shot of H Shop.

    Lee
    The views I express are PURELY my own. Please respect that.

  29. #89
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    Quote Originally Posted by Lee Howard View Post
    Bill

    When were you at FL then? You're right; there are photos of Suez-marked Wyverns in H Shop (my old stomping ground) and similarly-marked Sea Hawks in B Shop. There is a photo of a Wyvern using the gun butts between A and B Shops (incredibly pointing right towards the A32!) and there is a photo of the tail of a Wyvern being inspected during a visit of (FORA, I think). But other than that, I can't think of any others.

    It's nice to go back and visit every few months but the old place is a shadow of its former glory. I'm only glad I got to experience it as a proper RNAY!

    Lee
    Hi Lee:

    1957-63. I completed a 5 year aircraft fitter (airframes & engines) apprenticeship and then worked for a further year. The last 2 years in B shop on helicopters, mainly Dragonflies & Whirlwinds.
    I didn't work in H (or J) shops. I remember them at that time filled with Sea Hawks & Sea Venoms with a few Vampire T22's and the occasional Sea Prince.

    Funnily, my recollections of the butts between A & B shops always includes a Wyvern lurking in front of them. There was a story around Fleetlands at that time regarding checking the Wyverns guns. It was said that because the beast was so high on the first firing some of the rounds glanced off the roof of the butts ans fragments were later found embedded in a Gosport provincial double-decker bus that happened to be passing by on the A32 at that time. As I said "a good story"

    Rgds
    Bill

  30. #90
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    Fantastic pictures being posted here, especially the maintenance hangar shots, first time I've seen pics of Wyverns being worked on.

    Sorry if this is drifting a bit, but nice shot of 813 sqn Wyverns at RNAS Ford, aicraft that can be read are, VZ793 126, WL877 127, VZ791 129, WL87_ 124, & VZ79_

    Westland Wyverns 813 Sqn RNAS Ford by jamtey71, on Flickr

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