Announcement

Collapse
No announcement yet.

Russian Navy Thread 2.

Collapse
X
Collapse
Currently Active Users Viewing This Thread: 3 (0 members and 3 guests)
 
  • Filter
  • Time
  • Show
Clear All
new posts
  • JangBoGo
    Rank 5 Registered User
    • Jan 2011
    • 1510

    21300 Igor Belousov recently had a world tour and also visited Sri Lanka on way to its Pacific home base, not sure if it came to India as there was earlier reports about India interested in acquiring this class of ship which are necessary for rescue missions involving submarines.

    Its also a good thing to employ same design base for projects and we possibly can see the same w.r.t to this ship. Pr.21300 and 22010 share similar hull designs which in a sense have similarity with 11982. which looks like a scaled down of 21300 or maybe it was the other way round (considering that 21300 was laid up much earlier). In addition all of these three class of ships share similar propulsion & maneuvering layout - 2 electric propulsion pods and twin bow thrusters.


    Project 21300, Igor Belousov, Submarine/deep sea rescue vessel


    Project 22010, Yantar, Oceanographic research vessel


    Project 11982, Seligher, Research/Test/Trial vessel


    Last edited by JangBoGo; 19th August 2016, 19:26.

    Comment

    • TR1
      TR1
      http://tiny.cc/tp8kd
      • Oct 2010
      • 9826

      S, the Druzhny (the 1135 sitting in Moscow for years) has been moved and is being cut apart. RIP, I will miss seeing the ship @ the far end of the Tushino water reservoir.



      sigpic

      Comment

      • Deino
        Rank 5 Registered User
        • Jan 2000
        • 4228

        Originally posted by TR1 View Post
        MiG-29KR has made its first landing on the Kuznetsov.

        From the RuAF thread ...
        Attached Files
        ...

        He was my North, my South, my East and West,
        My working week and my Sunday rest,
        My noon, my midnight, my talk, my song;
        I thought that love would last forever; I was wrong.

        The stars are not wanted now; put out every one:
        Pack up the moon and dismantle the sun;
        Pour away the ocean and sweep up the woods:
        For nothing now can ever come to any good.
        -------------------------------------------------
        W.H.Auden (1945)

        Comment

        • YU1
          YU1
          Rank 5 Registered User
          • Feb 2011
          • 241

          Nice pic of 4 ships under construction. The ships are Petr Morgunov (Project 11711), Admiral Butakov (project 11356), Admiral Istomin (project 11356) and oceanographic research ship Yevgeniy Gorigledzhan.

          The ship in the 2nd pic is the 6th ship of project 11356 (Admiral Kornilov).
          Attached Files

          Comment

          • YU1
            YU1
            Rank 5 Registered User
            • Feb 2011
            • 241

            New video about the construction of Zvezda shipyard.



            New pics of the shipyard.
            http://sdelanounas.ru/blogs/82376/

            Comment

            • Blitzo
              Rank 5 Registered User
              • Jan 2011
              • 1332

              Originally posted by YU1 View Post
              Nice pic of 4 ships under construction. The ships are Petr Morgunov (Project 11711), Admiral Butakov (project 11356), Admiral Istomin (project 11356) and oceanographic research ship Yevgeniy Gorigledzhan.

              The ship in the 2nd pic is the 6th ship of project 11356 (Admiral Kornilov).
              Are those three Project 11356 FFGs still going to go to Russia, or are they the ones recently proposed to be exported to IN? (or putting it another way, are those three of the second batch of Grigorovich class FFGs the ones affected by the Ukraine powerplant issue?)


              Also, does anyone know what Shtil variant the Project 11356 actually uses? Over in the IN thread a few weeks back there were mentions that the class would be using a new 70km variant, but an article on Jane's about Admiral Essen's commissioning quoted an official sounding fellow (Navy Shipbuilding Department chief Vladimir Tryapichnikov), that the ship fielded Shtil-1 instead (50km)... with the quote being repeated on a number of other sites as well, TASS, Navyreco, among others.

              http://www.janes.com/article/61116/r...-essen-frigate

              Comment

              • TR1
                TR1
                http://tiny.cc/tp8kd
                • Oct 2010
                • 9826

                Well, the VLS Shtil uses the new 9M317M missile, which is also slated for Buk-M3, where it achieves a 70KM range.

                The actual performance of the VLS Shtil on domestic ships is not publicized, and we have debated on her as to the radar/range capacity of the unit, but the missiles can reach out to 70km.
                The 9M317 was able to reach 50km in its variants, so I would wager the newer round improves on it.

                9M96/E2 range is routinely quoted as 40km/120km, but the domestic variants are known to reach out to 60km/150km. So all in all, hard to say.

                And those 3 ships are the ones waiting for engines.
                Last edited by TR1; 30th August 2016, 00:19.
                sigpic

                Comment

                • Blitzo
                  Rank 5 Registered User
                  • Jan 2011
                  • 1332

                  Originally posted by TR1 View Post
                  Well, the VLS Shtil uses the new 9M317M missile, which is also slated for Buk-M3, where it achieves a 70KM range.

                  The actual performance of the VLS Shtil on domestic ships is not publicized, and we have debated on her as to the radar/range capacity of the unit, but the missiles can reach out to 70km.
                  The 9M317 was able to reach 50km in its variants, so I would wager the newer round improves on it.

                  9M96/E2 range is routinely quoted as 40km/120km, but the domestic variants are known to reach out to 60km/150km. So all in all, hard to say

                  Thanks for the reply.


                  I was under the impression that Shtil-1 is the name of the missile though? That is, 9M317ME and Shtil-1 are the same thing?

                  From a quick search, most places say that Buk-M3 is meant to be fielding the 9K317M... different to 9M317M/9M317ME/Shtil-1?


                  edit: or is Shtil-1 the name of the VLS or perhaps the naval SAM system itself and that the missile it uses is different? However, most of the brochures and advertisement online for Shtil-1 only associates it with the 9M317ME missile, not the Buk-M3's 9K317M?
                  Last edited by Blitzo; 30th August 2016, 00:21.

                  Comment

                  • TR1
                    TR1
                    http://tiny.cc/tp8kd
                    • Oct 2010
                    • 9826

                    Shtil-1 is the name of the complex. The predecessor was Uragan (both Naval Buk basically), also just called Shtil for export. I have seen Shtil-1 refer to the arm-launcher and VLS complex both, but we are dealing with mostly export brochures from almost a decade ago, hence my bet the domestic VLS shtil with 9M317M can reach out farther.

                    9K317 refers to the complex, the missile is conventionality enough the 9M317M. Don't be fooled by the closeness to the 9M317 round, the actual missile is completely new in construction.
                    sigpic

                    Comment

                    • Blitzo
                      Rank 5 Registered User
                      • Jan 2011
                      • 1332

                      Originally posted by TR1 View Post
                      Shtil-1 is the name of the complex. The predecessor was Uragan (both Naval Buk basically), also just called Shtil for export. I have seen Shtil-1 refer to the arm-launcher and VLS complex both, but we are dealing with mostly export brochures from almost a decade ago, hence my bet the domestic VLS shtil with 9M317M can reach out farther.

                      9K317 refers to the complex, the missile is conventionality enough the 9M317M. Don't be fooled by the closeness to the 9M317 round, the actual missile is completely new in construction.
                      I see.

                      So if the Buk-M3/9K317 really does use the 9M317M missile, then what does that mean for the 9M317ME? Because, based on designation, I was under the impression that 9M317ME is the export version of 9M317M... but I've also read that Buk-M3 is meant to be using a missile of a different designation (I'm not familiar with Russian designations, but I've come across everything from 9K317M to 9R31M for Buk-M3).

                      Also, Buk-M3, as far as I understand, is only meant to start to be fielded with land based systems this year. Considering that the 9M317ME was offered for export in the mid 2000s (?) along with the Shtil-1 VLS complex, if Buk-M3 really is using the domestic variant of the missile (9M317M) first offered about a decade ago, then is it using literally the same missile or merely the same airframe with more advanced internals/guidance? (And if it's using more advanced guidance to achieve the significantly greater performance of Buk-M3, wouldn't that warrant a new designation for the missile?)

                      Furthermore, in regards to the Project 11356 FFGs -- considering they were first laid down in 2010, well before the Buk-M3 had finished development or begun being fielded with land based systems, is it reasonable to conclude that the ships are using the domestic version of the 9M317ME missile instead of the Buk-M3's missile in their VLS?
                      Or putting it another way, has there been any indications to suggest that there is a naval-compatible Buk-M3 missile intended for the Shtil-1 VLS complex?
                      Last edited by Blitzo; 30th August 2016, 01:14.

                      Comment

                      • TR1
                        TR1
                        http://tiny.cc/tp8kd
                        • Oct 2010
                        • 9826

                        Buk-M3 is taking the naval 9M317M missile. ME is just the export designation of the naval round, but it has not been sold/seen until we saw admiral Grigorovich testing what is clearly the 9M317M (from arms-expo mockups previously seen, the layout was identical).

                        Buk-M3 has been delayed for many years and has been in testing for quite a few as well so it using a land-variant of the same round is unsurprising, plus we don't really know if 9M317M for VLS Shtil was even ready for production when the first export brochures appeared almost a decade ago.

                        Back in 2006 (around time 9M317M for Shtil started being advertised) the 9M317M was identified as intended for the Buk-M3 complex:
                        http://www.rosprom.org/news1198.html

                        Succesful interceptions with the 9M317M were completed in 2011:
                        http://sdelanounas.ru/blogs/42566/

                        So the 11356s are certainly using the naval flavor of the same missile intended for Buk-M3.

                        Range is more than just missile performance, so I am speculating a bit about the 70km range of the VLS Shtil complex, but the missile certainly has the capacity for it.
                        Last edited by TR1; 30th August 2016, 01:59.
                        sigpic

                        Comment

                        • Blitzo
                          Rank 5 Registered User
                          • Jan 2011
                          • 1332

                          Originally posted by TR1 View Post
                          Buk-M3 is taking the naval 9M317M missile. ME is just the export designation of the naval round, but it has not been sold/seen until we saw admiral Grigorovich testing what is clearly the 9M317M (from arms-expo mockups previously seen, the layout was identical).

                          Buk-M3 has been delayed for many years and has been in testing for quite a few as well so it using a land-variant of the same round is unsurprising, plus we don't really know if 9M317M for VLS Shtil was even ready for production when the first export brochures appeared almost a decade ago.

                          Back in 2006 (around time 9M317M for Shtil started being advertised) the 9M317M was identified as intended for the Buk-M3 complex:
                          http://www.rosprom.org/news1198.html

                          Succesful interceptions with the 9M317M were completed in 2011:
                          http://sdelanounas.ru/blogs/42566/

                          So the 11356s are certainly using the naval flavor of the same missile intended for Buk-M3.

                          Range is more than just missile performance, so I am speculating a bit about the 70km range of the VLS Shtil complex, but the missile certainly has the capacity for it.

                          Right -- in that case, do you know where the designation of 9R31M came from in relation to Buk-M3? Mistranslation?

                          And are there any more recent reports (in Russian?) about Buk-M3 tests confirming the designation of the missile? A search in English has turned up no results -- and the second link you listed does not seem to mention 9M317M as the missile, only that the Buk-M3 was tested?

                          (In essence, I'm wondering if there is a possibility that the 9M317M designation for the Buk-M3's missile may have changed between 2006 and 2016)

                          Comment

                          • TR1
                            TR1
                            http://tiny.cc/tp8kd
                            • Oct 2010
                            • 9826

                            I have seen some sources refer to the missile with that designation, but usually they indicate it is 9M317M in the same text as well.

                            But essentially every single Russian article about the system even over the past several years mentions 9M317M.
                            Also there is mention that the Buk-M3s rounds will have active-seeker heads.

                            Given how new the missile is, I find it highly unlikely a separate round was created and tested in this time frame, and has escaped all notice.
                            sigpic

                            Comment

                            • Austin
                              Rank 5 Registered User
                              • Oct 2003
                              • 6506

                              TR1 , if what you say is true then the BUK-M3 specs thrown around are not real one , They are claiming target intercept speed of 3000 m/sec for BUK-M3 , altitude of 35 km and range of 70 km, They also claim an intercept probability of 0.9 for BUK-M3

                              A higher intercept speed is only possible with missile with better Kinematic capability. Ofcourse its also possible that the same missile dimension has absolutely new energetic propellant but thats just my guess
                              "A map does you no good if you don't know where you are"

                              Comment

                              • TR1
                                TR1
                                http://tiny.cc/tp8kd
                                • Oct 2010
                                • 9826

                                Originally posted by Austin View Post

                                A higher intercept speed is only possible with missile with better Kinematic capability.
                                Not only- the radar and guidance systems are an equal part in this equation.

                                The Naval Shtil and Buk-M3 radar suits are very different.
                                sigpic

                                Comment

                                • TR1
                                  TR1
                                  http://tiny.cc/tp8kd
                                  • Oct 2010
                                  • 9826

                                  http://bmpd.livejournal.com/2097432.html

                                  http://djoker-lj.livejournal.com/240539.html

                                  Ka-52K and MiG-29K on Kuznetsov.
                                  sigpic

                                  Comment

                                  • TR1
                                    TR1
                                    http://tiny.cc/tp8kd
                                    • Oct 2010
                                    • 9826

                                    Originally posted by YU1 View Post
                                    New video about the construction of Zvezda shipyard.



                                    New pics of the shipyard.
                                    http://sdelanounas.ru/blogs/82376/
                                    So, the first vessel has been laid down at the new shipyard:

                                    http://bmpd.livejournal.com/2101932.html

                                    An enclosed floating dock the project 23380 "Zvezda".
                                    Apparently it will service project 955 SSBNs in the Far East; in the local climate enclosed docks are much easier to work in.

                                    sigpic

                                    Comment

                                    • TR1
                                      TR1
                                      http://tiny.cc/tp8kd
                                      • Oct 2010
                                      • 9826

                                      Ustinov ready to be handed over (almost):

                                      sigpic

                                      Comment

                                      • Zare
                                        Rank 5 Registered User
                                        • Dec 2006
                                        • 213

                                        What is the hull material and thickness of project Orlan and Atlant ships? Could they withstand any hits from pre-missile era guns like B-38?

                                        Comment

                                        • TR1
                                          TR1
                                          http://tiny.cc/tp8kd
                                          • Oct 2010
                                          • 9826

                                          6 inch gun? Nah no way, no modern ships have anything like the armored belts/bulkheads of the old battlewagons.

                                          ВМФ заказал еще три малых ракетных корабля типа Буян-М: Вооруженные силы: Силовые структуры: Lenta.ru


                                          Another 3 Byan-M will be ordered.

                                          ВМФ России заказал шесть подлодок проекта 636.3 для Тихого океана: Оружие: Силовые структуры: Lenta.ru

                                          And 6 636.6 have been ordered from Admirality (for the Pacific Fleet as rumored). Deliveries will be finished by 2021.
                                          Last edited by TR1; 7th September 2016, 18:35.
                                          sigpic

                                          Comment

                                          Unconfigured Ad Widget

                                          Collapse

                                           

                                          Working...
                                          X