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  • signatory
    Rank 5 Registered User
    • Jul 2004
    • 570

    Saab JAS 39 Gripen info

    Ok then, first post will contain pdfs to good information on the Gripen jet. All in the English language and official stuff. If links die I have saved backups.



    Read up on Gripen:
    --------------------------
    Gripen Overview: From 2007 - Lots of good general capability info from the Program Director, history, current, future.
    Gripen to Norway: General capabilities etc, similar type of document as above.

    Gripen Demo NG Info: April 2008 - Talks about Gripen Demo/NG weight, fuel, AESA, new Electronic Warfare suite etc that can either be applied to existing Gripens or customized NGs.

    Gripen News Demo Special Edition News from NG demo rollout, talks about NG and the Demonstrator.

    ISTAR Overview: Swedish military outlines ISTAR capabilities.
    Gripen News Magazine, back issues from 1997. Current issues here.

    NG Demo Info: General info about the Gripen DEMO and Next Generation development.
    NG Demo Testprogram Some info on flight testing the new F-414 powered Gripen Demo.
    New Architecture (schematics)

    NG to NL Brief Presentation to Holland, info abt Gripen NG with some examples on range/payload.
    NG to NL Info Presentation to Holland, additional info abt Gripen NG.

    Gripen NG to Netherlands, Third PDF

    Test Program update, from 2005, info about integration work, system updates, maintenance solutions.
    Gripen Presentation Nov-2008, VP OpCap Nilsson, Estonian Aviation Society.

    Gripen Presentation 2008: GI marketing brief.. General info including cutaway and 39C weapons chart.
    The Gripen Mission: GI marketing, talks about pilot gear, cockpit and swingrole missions.

    A summary of the only (?) official data on range that is available:

    Gripen to Brazil (2003 FOR JAS 39C), page 8.
    SwAF Air Tactical Command (1999) , page 39, Addendum B1.

    Range from above pdfs:

    JAS 39C
    Combat radius: 800 km internal fuel
    Combat radius: 1,550 Km with external fuel
    Ferry range: 3,200 Km

    ---------------------------
    Quick Facts:

    GE F-414G equipped Gripen NG Demo during heavy stores trials

    Gripen NG is only 4% heavier than JAS 39C but comes with over 22% more engine thrust.

    Engine improvement dry thrust: 25%
    Engine improvement wet thrust: 22%


    The F-414G engine will provide 20 to 25% more thrust over the existing RM12.
    The NG Demonstrator has flown the new airframe and engine since May 2008.
    Test phase 1 has performed maximum speed trials and heavy stores flutter tests.
    Test phase 2 to start from 2009 will include tests of new sensors such as AESA.

    Gripen NG Basic Specs (1)
    Number of Stations 10
    Empty weight 7.0 ton
    MTOW >16 ton
    Internal fuel >3.3 ton
    External fuel 3.8 ton
    Payload >6 ton

    Gripen NG Range (2)
    Range is increased an average of 40% over the JAS 39C as both the internal and external fuel capability is expanded.
    Combat radius: 1,300 Km + 30 minutes on station with A2A weapons.
    Range (one-way): 2,500 Km on internal fuel
    Ferry range (one-way): 4,075 Km with external fuel
    Combat Radius estimate: 1,800 km with A2A weapons

    One drop tank (450 Gal) gives the Gripen NG an extra range of approximately 1000 km.

    Design notice (3)
    To accomodate a higher airflow for the F-414G engine the forward intakes has been expanded by about an inch. These forward intakes is removable on all JAS 39 models for modifications. The Laser Designator Pod station was removed for the modifications and will return over time and might be moved forward at the same time. Installing the new engine into the NG Demonstrator was successful on first attempt with only minor adjustments. Two new ventral stations has been fitted to the central fuselage and a rearranged landing gear has created space for a new internal fuel tank. The Demonstrator (a rebuilt JAS39B/D) is used to show possible upgrades to existing Gripens or solutions for completely new models.

    The avionics planned for the NG is of the same products planned for C/D upgrades and is already part of the long term development and test program that existed before the launch of the NG Demonstrator. The F414 Gripen Demo is test aircraft 39-7 and flies next to her lighter RM12 sister 39-6. Other test aircraft is involved in the development such as 39-1 who is conducting METEOR missile tests with the PS/05A radar.

    Sources: [1], [2], [3] Additional source



    ---

    F414G on Gripen 39C ? Possible. Would increase the T/W ratio by 22%.

    -


    RCS, IR

    Gripen has very small Infra-red and radar signature. This has been further reduced for each new version. Gripen has less than 1/10th the average RCS of a F-16C and most likely the lowest RCS and IR signature of any non-stealth fighter today. A new Volvo Aero radial flame holder has significantly reduced the IR signature from the engine section. The aircraft has a innovative air/fuel distribution system with a set of heat exchangers, ram air intakes, shoulder placed exchaust ducts and computerized control to cool down the aircraft. When fuel reach a specified temperature from a heat source it is replaced by cooler fuel that has been distributed through these systems. The flash protection has been replaced in 39C to be a conductive paint as opposed to the metallic stripes this has both lowered rcs and support costs. Lights has been changed from bulbs to LED and there's also infra-red lights on the aircraft for lo-vis night flights so FAC's or wingmen with NVG can see the aircraft in the night.

    Signature reductions was part of design start, reduced for 39C and will according to the SwAF be further reduced for the Gripen NG.


    Gripen has yet to fly but Saab speaks of plans to reduce rcs

    The Swedish defence research agency names the average rcs of Gripen A to 0.1m2

    The 39C/D has a new airframe with reduced RCS

    Shoulder ducts to release excess heat from heat exchangers, placed over the wings to reduce visual IR signature from ground units.

    FOI


    Radar:




    Last edited by signatory; 2nd May 2009, 09:52.
  • 21Ankush
    Senior Member
    • Dec 2004
    • 1951

    #2
    good to see a thread on the Gripen. I did wonder why the Gripen never had a thread of its own like the Typhoon or Rafale did..now it'll be easier to follow the most recent happenings on the NG front as well.

    Comment

    • Venky
      Member
      • Jul 2008
      • 87

      #3
      Thanks for the effort and hope this thread will be "unpolluted", as Gripen will be around for so many upcoming copetition.

      Comment

      • LoofahBoy
        Grab the bucket
        • Oct 2007
        • 502

        #4
        Originally posted by Venky View Post
        Thanks for the effort and hope this thread will be "unpolluted", as Gripen will be around for so many upcoming copetition.
        Bah. The minute someone on this forum mentions the words "Tejas" or "J-10" this thread is going south.

        Comment

        • Mitch Richards
          Junior Member
          • Nov 2008
          • 25

          #5
          Another Gripen is the best jet ever thread, how tiresome.

          Comment

          • flex297
            Senior Member
            • Aug 2003
            • 10590

            #6
            Originally posted by LoofahBoy View Post
            Bah. The minute someone on this forum mentions the words "Tejas" or "J-10" this thread is going south.
            So, which one is better? Gripen or J-10?



            Sorry.. Could not resist..

            Comment

            • Trident
              Rank 5 Registered User
              • May 2004
              • 3951

              #7
              Originally posted by Mitch Richards View Post
              Another Gripen is the best jet ever thread, how tiresome.
              Another Mitch Richards post which adds zero value to the discussion, how tiresome.

              Don't click on the topic. How hard can it be?
              sigpic

              Comment

              • bgnewf
                Fighting Newfoundlander
                • May 2008
                • 595

                #8
                Can someone more familiar with the Gripen program, and the disposition of the Swedish "A/B" models perhaps answer some of the following questions I have?

                1) Can we confirm exactly how many of these used Gripens are available for sale or lease to foreign countries, now that Sweden is going with an approximate number of 100 active updated Gripens?

                2) What countries have been approached with offers for new or used Gripens?

                3) Are there any American restrictions placed on Gripen exports based on technology transfer? Has this been an issue to date?

                4) Has Saab ever actively thought about a non US engine (M-88, or EJ-200 perhaps?) as a means to untie the Gripen from US export restrictions?

                Any help greatly appreciated.

                Cheers


                Postscript: About time this thread was started.
                "It was a magnificent display of trained and disciplined valour, and its assault only failed of success because dead men can advance no further."

                Comment

                • flex297
                  Senior Member
                  • Aug 2003
                  • 10590

                  #9
                  Originally posted by bgnewf View Post
                  Can someone more familiar with the Gripen program, and the disposition of the Swedish "A/B" models perhaps answer some of the following questions I have?

                  1) Can we confirm exactly how many of these used Gripens are available for sale or lease to foreign countries, now that Sweden is going with an approximate number of 100 active updated Gripens?

                  2) What countries have been approached with offers for new or used Gripens?

                  3) Are there any American restrictions placed on Gripen exports based on technology transfer? Has this been an issue to date?

                  4) Has Saab ever actively thought about a non US engine (M-88, or EJ-200 perhaps?) as a means to untie the Gripen from US export restrictions?

                  Any help greatly appreciated.

                  Cheers


                  Postscript: About time this thread was started.
                  1. Within an idea of closer defense cooperation between Sweden, Finland and Norway (common fighter aircraft type) between 40-60 surplus upgraded Gripens were offered for sale to these two countries.

                  Now, let us do some research:

                  Up to date, following A/B aircraft were procured in two batches (disregarding prototypes). Batch 1: 29 JAS39A and Batch 2: 76 JAS39A + 15 JAS39B

                  Three JAS39As were written off so far, one in 1993, one in 1999 and one in 2005. 12 JAS39C and 2 JAS39D aircraft from Batch 1 were already upgraded to C/D standard and sold to Hungary. That leaves 90+13 A/B aircraft available.

                  So far 70 JAS39C and 16 JAS39D were produced, 12+2 of those for Czech Republic and two for SAAF by now. One swedish aircraft has crashed in 2007. Now, if you count planned strength of Swedish AF on 100 C/D Gripens, it is clear some need to be converted from A/B since only 57 Cs and 12 Ds are serving in Sweden today. If 31 need to be converted for Sweden, then the number of remaining A/B aircraft available is 72 machines for sale in total. This is the best case number.

                  2. Except Finland and Norway I can remember Thailand, Romania, Czech Republic and Hungary. Surely there were even more of them.

                  3. Of course, yes. The restrictions are being placed on engine, as well as parts of FBW system and other avionics (?)

                  4. EJ200 was seriously considered at one time. Never heard about SNECMA, though.
                  Last edited by flex297; 10th November 2008, 16:48.

                  Comment

                  • flex297
                    Senior Member
                    • Aug 2003
                    • 10590

                    #10
                    NOTE:

                    I was being very accurate this time! Here is the official programme commitment from Jane's:

                    http://www.janes.com/info/idr/articl...n-secures.html

                    The less-publicised part of the Gripen contract funds the conversion of 31 early-model JAS 39A/B aircraft to the latest JAS 39C/D standard for the SAF. Sweden will standardise on the C/D model and the remaining A/Bs will be withdrawn from service by about 2012. Of the 31 onversions, 18 will be JAS 39Cs and 13 will be JAS 39D two-seaters. The rebuild programme will run between 2007 and 2012

                    OK, let us sum it up:

                    From 90+13, 18+13 will be converted. That leaves 72 JAS39A and zero JAS39B aircraft available for sale. Any twin-seaters for any future customer will need to be new-built.
                    Last edited by flex297; 10th November 2008, 16:48.

                    Comment

                    • bgnewf
                      Fighting Newfoundlander
                      • May 2008
                      • 595

                      #11
                      Thank you flex297. Very informative.

                      The other thing that comes to mind is about the RBS-15. Does it have a land attack capability and would Sweden be game for integrating that onto export Gripens?

                      Sounds like a poor mans's Storm Shadow
                      "It was a magnificent display of trained and disciplined valour, and its assault only failed of success because dead men can advance no further."

                      Comment

                      • Trident
                        Rank 5 Registered User
                        • May 2004
                        • 3951

                        #12
                        Originally posted by bgnewf View Post
                        Thank you flex297. Very informative.

                        The other thing that comes to mind is about the RBS-15. Does it have a land attack capability and would Sweden be game for integrating that onto export Gripens?

                        Sounds like a poor mans's Storm Shadow
                        The naval variant does have a land attack capability in its latest iterations. Why go down that route however when Sweden is one of the major partners in the Taurus cruise missile programme? The only thing potentially preventing export of the Taurus is that its range may violate non-proliferation treaties, but that can be taken care of by developing a downgraded variant (less fuel, turbojet rather than turbofan engine). This would be a far more effective weapon than RBS-15 could ever hope to be in the land attack role.
                        sigpic

                        Comment

                        • Merlock
                          Rank 5 Registered User
                          • Aug 2005
                          • 583

                          #13
                          Thanks forbthis thread, signatory, I'd be glad to learn more about the Gripen!

                          Comment

                          • Scorpion82
                            Rank 5 Registered User
                            • Jul 2005
                            • 4463

                            #14
                            Originally posted by flex297 View Post
                            Up to date, following A/B aircraft were procured in two batches (disregarding prototypes). Batch 1: 29 JAS39A and Batch 2: 76 JAS39A + 15 JAS39B

                            Three JAS39As were written off so far, one in 1993, one in 1999 and one in 2005. 12 JAS39C and 2 JAS39D aircraft from Batch 1 were already upgraded to C/D standard and sold to Hungary. That leaves 90+13 A/B aircraft available.

                            So far 70 JAS39C and 16 JAS39D were produced, 12+2 of those for Czech Republic and two for SAAF by now. One swedish aircraft has crashed in 2007. Now, if you count planned strength of Swedish AF on 100 C/D Gripens, it is clear some need to be converted from A/B since only 57 Cs and 12 Ds are serving in Sweden today. If 31 need to be converted for Sweden, then the number of remaining A/B aircraft available is 72 machines for sale in total. This is the best case number.
                            Some small corrections.

                            - Batch 1 ordered in 1982 covered 30 JAS 39A. The first aircraft (39-101) was kept by Saab as a replacement for the crashed first prototype (39-1). The second aircraft (39-102), actually the first handed over to the FMV on June 8 1993 crashed in August the same year. The last batch 1 aircraft became the JAS 39B prototype.

                            - Batch 2 ordered in 1992 covered 96 JAS 39A and 14 JAS 39B according the original plan. Batch 2 was divided into 3 lots. The third lot covering 20 aircraft which were built to JAS 39C Mk3 standard.

                            - Batch 3 ordered in 1997 covered 50 JAS 39C and 14 JAS 39D

                            Czech republic:
                            Received 12 JAS 39C and 2 JAS 39D from the swedish batch 3 contingent

                            Hungary:
                            Planned to buy 12 JAS 39A and 2 JAS 39B upgraded by BAE Systems to a NATO compatible standard. The plan was rejected in favour for a direct purchase of new built JAS 39C/D in the same quantity. These aircraft are built on top of the swedish order and are not diverted from the swedish batch 3.

                            Flygvapnets 100 JAS 39C/D fleet:
                            20 JAS 39C from batch 2/lot 3, 50 JAS 39C & 14 JAS 39D from batch 3 = 84 JAS 39C/D. 84 - 14 for Czech = 70 aircraft.
                            70 - 1 crashed = 69 aircraft. 31 JAS 39A/B to be converted to C/D standard = 69 + 31 = 100.

                            Comment

                            • Sign
                              Rank 5 Registered User
                              • Oct 2008
                              • 1579

                              #15
                              Originally posted by bgnewf View Post
                              Thank you flex297. Very informative.

                              The other thing that comes to mind is about the RBS-15. Does it have a land attack capability and would Sweden be game for integrating that onto export Gripens?

                              Sounds like a poor mans's Storm Shadow
                              RBS-15s Shadow KEPD 350
                              warhead 200kg 450kg 500kg
                              weight 800kg 1230kg 1400kg
                              range >200km >240km >500km
                              Seeker Act-Radar/GPS/Inertial inertial/GPS/IR inertial/IR/GPS/IBN
                              Signature nonstealth stealth stealth
                              in service -85 -02 ?
                              Operators 7 5 3 orders?
                              Unit price ? 800000eur 950000eur

                              The RBS-15 platform has been around since the the 80:s. the size and warhead was optimized for taken down a "big ship". So maybe shadow/KEPD will be an littorly overkill for that kind of target.

                              It would be nice to know the unitprice of the RBS15?
                              Anyone that knows?

                              And its also very flexible with land/marine/air launch to land/ship

                              Thailand has bought the RBS-15F for its gripens. Dont know if the have land-attack..

                              The KEPD 350 will be integrated on gripen, dont know when thou..
                              Last edited by Sign; 10th November 2008, 19:33.

                              Comment

                              • fft
                                fft
                                Rank 5 Registered User
                                • Sep 2003
                                • 295

                                #16
                                Gripen Radar

                                Is the gripen radar purely swedish or a product of europeon cooperation.

                                Comment

                                • bgnewf
                                  Fighting Newfoundlander
                                  • May 2008
                                  • 595

                                  #17
                                  My understanding the current radar is completely Swedish in origin. I think that they are collaborating with other European countries on an AESA refit for the front end of the current radar, but I am not completely sure.
                                  "It was a magnificent display of trained and disciplined valour, and its assault only failed of success because dead men can advance no further."

                                  Comment

                                  • Sign
                                    Rank 5 Registered User
                                    • Oct 2008
                                    • 1579

                                    #18
                                    Originally posted by fft View Post
                                    Is the gripen radar purely swedish or a product of europeon cooperation.
                                    The PS-05A is a SAAB Microwave product(former Ericsson microwave) some parts evolved from Blue Vixen radar (United Kingdom), the mechanical parts.

                                    The new AESA will have a non-swedish antenna(front-end), but rest from SMW(back-end).
                                    The maker of the antenna is still a buisness matter. Best performance and politics is usually the case the choice.

                                    Comment

                                    • swerve
                                      Rank 5 Registered User
                                      • Jun 2005
                                      • 13604

                                      #19
                                      Originally posted by Trident View Post
                                      The only thing potentially preventing export of the Taurus is that its range may violate non-proliferation treaties, but that can be taken care of by developing a downgraded variant (less fuel, turbojet rather than turbofan engine).
                                      Or revive the shorter range KEPD-150.
                                      Juris praecepta sunt haec: honeste vivere, alterum non laedere, suum cuique tribuere.
                                      Justinian

                                      Comment

                                      • aerospacetech
                                        Rank 5 Registered User
                                        • Jan 2000
                                        • 1459

                                        #20
                                        Originally posted by Sign View Post
                                        The PS-05A is a SAAB Microwave product(former Ericsson microwave) some parts evolved from Blue Vixen radar (United Kingdom), the mechanical parts.
                                        Ferranti - Ericcson co-operated in this timeframe and the cooperation went both ways, so Ericcson-developed parts can be found in Blue Vixen.
                                        Available now: my book Hawker P.1103 and P.1121: Camm's Last Fighter Projects from Blue Envoy Press

                                        Comment

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