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Rafale 2018 Thread: Europe's best Eurocanard

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  • mrmalaya
    Generation 4.75+++

    What a dumb thing to say about Typhoon.

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    • TomcatViP
      Rank 5 Registered User

      And nobody seems to have noticed that with 5 Rafle carrying each two Scalp and only 9 launched toward Syria, one may have been defectuous.
      Last edited by TomcatViP; 17th April 2018, 19:25.

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      • EC 5/25 Corsair
        Rank 5 Registered User

        Yes, we did. No idea about its fate, either malfunctioned at launched, jettisoned... One sure thing, it was not under the Rafale's wing at RTB.

        What a dumb thing to say about Typhoon.
        care to elaborate?

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        • Cream
          Rank 5 Registered User

          I noticed that too but but my guess was that they realise that the job was done with 9 and so they don't launch the 10rd because it cost about 850k euros, i'm maybe too optimistic or not enough pessimistic ...

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          • St. John
            Rank 3 Registered User

            It's (un)surprisingly unable to perform any long range cruise misisle strike and will remain so.

            care to elaborate?
            I think he means that Storm Shadow is almost qualified and it would surely be fairly easy to take-off from Cyprus, fire it and RTB, which is about the extent of the strike mission conducted here.

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            • Cream
              Rank 5 Registered User

              The thing is that with the Typhoon you need 8 of them to launch eight Storm Shadow (with 2 EFT each) or four of them with only one belly EFT and then i think it becomes a nightmare in term of refuelling, so it's easiest to use the old Tornado GR4...
              Last edited by Cream; 17th April 2018, 19:47.

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              • xman
                Rank 5 Registered User

                Most likely the 10 th scalp did not initialized as expected or its auto diagnostic return a fail at time of launch and ultimately was jettisoned . On return all aircrafts had no ordnance left. Make sens given the distance and refuelling to go through to get rid of it rather that risk a return with an asymmetrical draggy dude. So for once the redundancies were used.

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                • Sintra
                  Rank 5 Registered User

                  The level of know how in this particular topic about the Typhoon keeps getting better...
                  The reason why the Typhoon was not not used with the Storm Shadow is because the weapon has not been declared operational on that particular airframe.
                  The MBDA Storm Shadow will be declared operational on Phoon by the end of this year right before the Tornado bows out in 2019.
                  sigpic

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                  • EC 5/25 Corsair
                    Rank 5 Registered User

                    That does not invalidate that the A/G (esp. cruise missile) layout for the Typhoon is sub optimal and makes it unable to perform long range strike as long as CFT are not integrated.

                    A Typhoon with 2 ALCM would barely carry 5,5 tons of fuel with a puny centerline tank, with most of its counterparts topping off with 50 to nearly 100% (Super Hornet, Rafale) more fuel. It's completely unfit for the role.

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                    • Cream
                      Rank 5 Registered User

                      I'm really sorry if i being too optimistic about the current operational capability of the Typhoon, maybe i read too much the Typhoon's fanboys.
                      I almost thought he had an operational AESA radar ...

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                      • Nicolas10
                        Senior Member

                        But the Typhoon is so much better in air combat...

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                        • EC 5/25 Corsair
                          Rank 5 Registered User

                          let's be real, the Typhoon is a very serious player in air superiority.

                          some people are just too prone to fall to Eurofighter's marketed bells and whistles (genuinely or not, I cannot blame)...
                          Last edited by EC 5/25 Corsair; 17th April 2018, 20:42.

                          Comment

                          • FBW
                            FBW
                            Rank 5 Registered User

                            152 to 96- I don’t think the resident Rafale club should be knocking the aircraft that has secured more export orders. Obviously, operators see capability in the Typhoon.

                            Personally, I’m a “fan” of the Rafale as the more capable multirole aircraft due to a clear, funded upgrade path. If the consortium ever gets its act together and maximizes the inherent potential of the Typhoon, it will be a potent multirole fighter into the next decade and a competitor for the Rafale in markets shut to the F-35. Bets on if that will happen? I don’t like the odds.

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                            • mrmalaya
                              Generation 4.75+++

                              Every cell in my being cries out not to get drawn into a 2002 style discussion on this, but the fact is that Typhoon will be taking over the Storm Shadow launch role in a matter of months when Tornado bows out.

                              If the RAF want it to carry two missiles underwing then it will carry two and use the tankers they have. If they decide this is too much like had work (they are very proud of their tanking capability though, its almost like they enjoy it), then CFTs may appear. At this stage CFTs dont seem to be that important.
                              Last edited by mrmalaya; 18th April 2018, 08:03.

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                              • St. John
                                Rank 3 Registered User

                                The thing is that with the Typhoon you need 8 of them to launch eight Storm Shadow (with 2 EFT each) or four of them with only one belly EFT and then i think it becomes a nightmare in term of refuelling, so it's easiest to use the old Tornado GR4...
                                Have you seen where RAF Akrotiri is in relation to Syria? If the missile could be ground launched, you wouldn't even need a plane at all, never mind IFR.

                                Most likely the 10 th scalp did not initialized as expected or its auto diagnostic return a fail at time of launch and ultimately was jettisoned . On return all aircrafts had no ordnance left. Make sens given the distance and refuelling to go through to get rid of it rather that risk a return with an asymmetrical draggy dude. So for once the redundancies were used.
                                Or some or all were Rafale Ms, which only carry 1 on centreline for roll stability reasons.
                                Last edited by St. John; 18th April 2018, 12:36.

                                Comment

                                • Sintra
                                  Rank 5 Registered User

                                  Originally posted by EC 5/25 Corsair View Post
                                  That does not invalidate that the A/G (esp. cruise missile) layout for the Typhoon is sub optimal and makes it unable to perform long range strike as long as CFT are not integrated.

                                  A Typhoon with 2 ALCM would barely carry 5,5 tons of fuel with a puny centerline tank, with most of its counterparts topping off with 50 to nearly 100% (Super Hornet, Rafale) more fuel. It's completely unfit for the role.
                                  Warn the RAF, they didnt get your memo
                                  sigpic

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                                  • TomcatViP
                                    Rank 5 Registered User

                                    St John: there is a video of the takeoff:

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                                    • Cream
                                      Rank 5 Registered User

                                      Btw according to Russian officials:

                                      General Staff Colonel Sergei Rudskoy indicated that: "French aircraft have not been registered by the Russian air defence systems." ...

                                      http://eng.mil.ru/en/news_page/count...2171300@egNews

                                      Maybe the french operation was an hoax, who knows?

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                                      • halloweene
                                        Rank 5 Registered User

                                        Or maybe Rafale is more efficient than for ex. F-35?

                                        Comment

                                        • Cream
                                          Rank 5 Registered User

                                          Or some or all were Rafale Ms, which only carry 1 on centreline for roll stability reasons.
                                          The Rafale M is just basically a Rafale with stronger landing gear so if they operate from the ground they can carry 2 Scalp. The limitation come from the "bring back capability" on carrier in case of only one cruise missile was launched and so you have to land on a carrier with a big asymetrical load (or you have to jetisson a 800k euros cruise missile). And there is no two-seater Rafale M.Click image for larger version

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