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RuAF News and development Thread part 15

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  • KGB
    KGB
    Senior Member
    • Mar 2016
    • 1426

    @eagle

    Yeah. A Frog Foot 2 would be a lot better. Just find a place to hang some high bypass pods like the A10.

    Comment

    • Austin
      Rank 5 Registered User
      • Oct 2003
      • 6479

      Russia Gives Update On New AWACS Plan

      https://www.ainonline.com/aviation-n...new-awacs-plan
      "A map does you no good if you don't know where you are"

      Comment

      • stealthflanker
        Rank 5 Registered User
        • Sep 2015
        • 1016

        So the new A-100 will likely be more similar to A-50EI with 3 face AESA. That's a good development. I wonder if it will also choose L-band, thus simplifying the design a bit by no need to include separate antenna and transmit-receive system for IFF. There could also be E-2D solution of keeping the mechanical rotation But add electronic steering (usual AEW radar only scans electronically in elevation except E-2) Thus when need arise for sector scan, the rotodome can be "stopped" and let the beam scans the sector electronically. The downside is of course there would be no IFF (as the IFF would be installed in the back face of array, similar as typical AEW like E-3)

        Comment

        • JSR
          JSR
          Rank 5 Registered User
          • Aug 2011
          • 4976

          with arrival of Tu-160M2 there is less need for A-100. Tu-160M2 simply provide more engine power, higher altitude, longer range and quick entry and exit.

          Comment

          • haavarla
            Rank 5 Registered User
            • Dec 2008
            • 6697

            I just had to look^^ was inst hit with remorse..
            Thanks

            Comment

            • Berkut
              Senior Member
              • Nov 2011
              • 2216

              And due to haavarla's curiosity i became morbidly curious too... After reading JSR's comment i am pretty sure i now have cancer.

              Comment

              • Nicolas10
                Senior Member
                • May 2005
                • 4523

                I thought it was hilarious.

                Nic

                Comment

                • Sintra
                  Rank 5 Registered User
                  • Aug 2007
                  • 3849

                  Originally posted by Berkut View Post
                  And due to haavarla's curiosity i became morbidly curious too... After reading JSR's comment i am pretty sure i now have cancer.
                  I have the chap on my ignore list, but you've just made me curious!
                  sigpic

                  Comment

                  • Austin
                    Rank 5 Registered User
                    • Oct 2003
                    • 6479

                    A CAS based Su-34 wont be a bad idea as Su-25 would outreach its design and being a small aircraft it has limitations in avionic/jammes/radar etc it can carry.

                    Su-34 has armoured cockpit and widely space engine a key requirement for CAS if its gets hit likely they would uparmour other areas vulnerable to hits plus it can carry a big radar ( no need for Pod in case of Su-25 ) and can also carry more armamenets , internal EW suite etc and larger persistence on field.

                    They had planned to build a new replacement for Su-25 which was dropped due to Cost reason and then they even thought about making Yak-130 into cas but that was a non starter too so Su-34 seems be on the radar now.
                    "A map does you no good if you don't know where you are"

                    Comment

                    • haavarla
                      Rank 5 Registered User
                      • Dec 2008
                      • 6697

                      Austin the Su-34 is just fine as it is. Just ditch the Su-25 when it expire. And focus on a deecent Sniper Pod.
                      Thanks

                      Comment

                      • Sintra
                        Rank 5 Registered User
                        • Aug 2007
                        • 3849

                        A CAS based Su-34 wont be a bad idea
                        Its an awfull one.
                        The SU-34 its a 22,5 tons clean weight behemoth, its a massive aircraft, its operating costs will be huge by comparison with the SU-25, the chances of the VVS getting a one to one airframe replacement are zero.
                        sigpic

                        Comment

                        • TR1
                          TR1
                          http://tiny.cc/tp8kd
                          • Oct 2010
                          • 9819

                          The Su-25 is fine as is, what it needs is a good defensive suite, flying CAS without it is suicide in any half-modern scenario. SM3 has a hugely increased defensive suite compared to SM, but unfortunately it looks like DIRCM was dropped, which IMO is a necessity.

                          R-95/195 is plentiful and mega cheap, would not be worth the effort to re-engine it IMO.

                          Single seat Su-34 is just working backwards, ridiculous proposition.

                          Su-34 has armor in several areas other than cockpit AFAIK, including engines and fuel storage.
                          sigpic

                          Comment

                          • maurobaggio
                            Rank 5 Registered User
                            • Jul 2008
                            • 521

                            I do not know if I'm on the 'same page' as the interviewee from article, however the idea from single seat version from 2 generation Su-34 could have been keeping some favorable factors at its side, since all 5 Generation fighters are single seat (F-22, F-35, Su-57, J-20, FC-31) and mostly of the 4.5 Generation, and several of those will be used in deep strikes as well as CAS ( Close Air Support).

                            During the development of the Su-27IB (Su-34) in the 80s it were envisaged that the Su-27IB (Su-34) could have been equipped with ejection cockpit such as the F-111 from US, however due to the high weight( titanium armor plate) and dimensions of the cockpit from Su-24 the idea was abandoned early, since its complexity( seize and weight) would require a large and heavy parachute that would take up a lot of internal space that otherwise should have been earmarked for avionics and fuel.

                            In the same way it were considered such ejection cockpit with titanium armor plate from Su-25T (Su-39) , even for the attack helicopter Ka-50 , during the 80's. But even such armored cockpit for single pilot would require large parachute for such 'small' dimensions of the Su-25T, in the same way would occupy too much space that could be better intended for avionics and fuel.

                            The reason for these idea from armored and ejection cockpit came as the the result of the Afghan War in the 1980s, once the Soviet pilots had been ejecting from their damaged aircraft were targeted as they descended from parachute, then this armored cockpit could serve as shelters until the rescue arrive.

                            The most critical problem in the rescue of pilots and crew has been this possibility: they can be surrounded by enemy troops, and due to the proximity of these enemy troops often it has been highly risk to carry out air attacks against those enemy troops without hitting the own downed pilots.

                            However, if the pilots could have been sheltered in this armored cockpit, the attacks will carried out with low risk, especially with the use of fragmentary and incendiary (thermobaric) weapons.

                            The C-SAR operations are extremely difficult and complex, especially if such clever enemy instead of capturing or even killing the downed crew members using them as baits, in which case the enemy will approaches discreetly at the downed crew members, and will keeping hidden until the arrival of the helicopters with the C-SAR teams, only when the C-SAR team has been approaching or even landing in the ground the enemy will opens fire turning one target into several.

                            However in the case of this suppose version single seat of the Su-34 this could have been received an armored cockpit with ejection capability, today it would not be possible with the Su-34 with its two crew, otherwise with cockpit for a single pilot this would be smaller and lighter than the Su-34,in that case will increasing the maneuverability as well as decreasing the front RCS of this supposedly new version Su-34.

                            With ejection cockpit there is no need for an ejection seat, in this case the pilot's seat could have been capable to recline as the first-class or executive commercial airlines, until now I have not verified if they really work as demonstrated in the movies, but if it really works the pilot could rest or stretch during long missions, or even access compartments with food and liquids in the back of this supposed cabin, thus keeping the same concept of the current Su-34.

                            Just a curiosity about the Su-25 with R-95 turbojets engines: in fact the Su-25 (T-8) prototype were designed with Al-25T turbofan engines, but under the requirements of the former VVS (Soviet Union Air Force) the T-8 had been equipped with RD-9B turbojets ( R-95). Among several factors for this change such detail aren't much known like such capability this R-95 turbojet engine also operate with diesel fuel in an emergency mode (maximum of 2 hours).

                            It seems that were a desire of the VVS that Su-25 had bee capable to operate with diesel fuel even in combat missions too, since the diesel fuel is less susceptible to the explosion and fire than the aviation kerosene, therefore the combination of sealed fuel tanks and diesel fuel could have been making the Su-25 more resilient in combat like CAS operations. This were not possible with R-95, however the R-95 engines has been capable with this emergency mode to operate with diesel fuel, about the R-195 turbojet engine from Su-25TM(Su-39) I am not aware if its possible.

                            AFAIK there has been a lot of discussion about the replacement of Su-25SM, since such UCAV based into YAK-130 that has been under development since 2006, or even by MiG-29M2 / MiG-35, but it has already been widely reported over time that Su-34 will take over the missions from Su-25SM when it will be withdrawn from service.

                            Comment

                            • JSR
                              JSR
                              Rank 5 Registered User
                              • Aug 2011
                              • 4976

                              Tu-160M2 is the only logical solution as its large and fast platform with flexibility of all kind of weopons in single mission. AWACS have large crew that is expensive by itself and it need other platforms for protection and strike. sensors and shooter in same platform the best.

                              Comment

                              • haavarla
                                Rank 5 Registered User
                                • Dec 2008
                                • 6697

                                Must not look^^



                                Baggio@
                                Why should VKS keep at the fast flying CAS platform. Surly they are(just like A-10) a tool from Soviet era.
                                If Russia can field a decent Sniper pods and use it on all their Flankers and Su-34.. Hell even Tu-22M3 as long as it remains in service, then the Su-25 is not really needed anymore.
                                O=n top of this Russia have a pretty impressive new fleet of Mi-28 and Ka-52 going by now.
                                Thanks

                                Comment

                                • stealthflanker
                                  Rank 5 Registered User
                                  • Sep 2015
                                  • 1016

                                  hmm i wonder if Russia will digitize the Tu-22M3 the same manner as B1.. like putting ability to carry guided bombs. Putting the targeting pod would be one of the fastest option.

                                  Would also love to see Tu-22M3 firing Kalibr.

                                  Comment

                                  • Marcellogo
                                    Rank 5 Registered User
                                    • Jun 2014
                                    • 1838

                                    For what I have read the VKS is absolutely happy of having the simple and rugged Su-25 in its inventory, given the stunningly high mission generation rate it has proven capable to perform compared to the much more complex Fulcrum and even Fencer and has so not any intention to renounce at it almost for the next years, nor there is have ever been any pressure from Frontal Aviation to substitute it with some shiny fighter like it happen with A-10 and USAF...

                                    Comment

                                    • Nicolas10
                                      Senior Member
                                      • May 2005
                                      • 4523

                                      hmm i wonder if Russia will digitize the Tu-22M3 the same manner as B1.. like putting ability to carry guided bombs. Putting the targeting pod would be one of the fastest option.

                                      Would also love to see Tu-22M3 firing Kalibr.
                                      Well watching them drop dumb bombs on dumb jihad joes doesn't get old if you ask me.

                                      Nic

                                      Comment

                                      • stealthflanker
                                        Rank 5 Registered User
                                        • Sep 2015
                                        • 1016

                                        naturally i want some new capability

                                        Would love to hear conventional land attack version of Kh-32 tho hahaha. 1 Ton warhead.

                                        Comment

                                        • TR1
                                          TR1
                                          http://tiny.cc/tp8kd
                                          • Oct 2010
                                          • 9819



                                          Soon.
                                          sigpic

                                          Comment

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