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SAAB Gripen and Gripen NG thread #4

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    SAAB Gripen and Gripen NG thread #4

    Last thread reached over 100 pages so I thought it would be a idea to start a new one.
    Sum ergo cogito

    #2
    Slovakia's Defense Ministry is planning to sign a deal to lease Saab JAS-39 Gripen fighter jets from the aircraft manufacturer following the parliamentary election which is scheduled for March 2016, the ministry's spokesman told local business daily E15.

    http://www.defensenews.com/story/def...tion/78307514/
    Sum ergo cogito

    Comment


      #3
      Swedish-Finn Alliance May Influence Fighter Choice

      The deepening in bilateral defense collaboration between non-aligned Nordic states Sweden and Finland is expected to include the establishment of joint units and the sharing of naval and Air Force infrastructure.

      Moreover, Sweden remains interested in selling the JAS Gripen-E to Finland, which has begun the process of replacing the Air Force’s F/A-18 C/D Hornet aircraft, which are scheduled to be retired between 2025 and 2030.

      Although government officials remain tight lipped, the increasingly closer military cooperation between Finland and Sweden advances the possibility that Finland may opt to pursue a replacement strategy that includes two different NATO-compatible fighter types, one of which could be the Gripen E.
      http://www.defensenews.com/story/def...oice/78801218/

      Operate 2 types? Why?
      Sum ergo cogito

      Comment


        #4
        For reference and quick access, old thread is there: SAAB Gripen and Gripen NG thread #3.

        Comment


          #5
          Originally posted by Spitfire9 View Post
          Swedish-Finn Alliance May Influence Fighter Choice



          http://www.defensenews.com/story/def...oice/78801218/

          Operate 2 types? Why?
          Because foreign political relations and closer military ties often trump fiscal sanity. Does this point then to an equal buy of F-35s and Gripen Es?

          Comment


            #6
            Originally posted by Spitfire9 View Post
            Swedish-Finn Alliance May Influence Fighter Choice



            http://www.defensenews.com/story/def...oice/78801218/

            Operate 2 types? Why?
            Operating 2 types has its benefits in case of one type should, for what ever reason, be grounded. With two types you always have a peacetime air-patrol capacity. Finland used to operate MiG-21 and Draken.

            Comment


              #7
              I doubt they are actually planning to operate two different fighters.

              Comment


                #8
                Originally posted by Ozair View Post
                Because foreign political relations and closer military ties often trump fiscal sanity.
                No, more likely Finland is realizing it's economy is going down the drain and they won't be able to afford F-35s.

                Comment


                  #9
                  Originally posted by JakobS View Post
                  No, more likely Finland is realizing it's economy is going down the drain and they won't be able to afford F-35s.
                  Well the article never mentions economic issues associated with possibly acquiring two types. What is does state is that Sweden is keen for Finland to operate the Gripen and have a two type fleet, ceding half the fleet to another airframe...

                  "There has been some speculative noise in Sweden that Saab would do a deal with Finland even in a theoretical contract situation where Finland chose to acquire two different aircraft types. Finlands fighter replacement process has just commenced, so it is much too early to predict an outcome here," said Kehl.
                  The rumours aren't coming from Finland... If Finland does chose to operate two types it will be for political reasons as operating two types is a waste of resources. The canadian capability assessment I posted in another thread is pretty clear that operating two similar types is a waste of money and limits the number of available aircraft.

                  Based on reasonable assumptions, the RCAF can maintain anticipated domestic and international commitments using a single fleet of 65 fighter aircraft and 90 pilots.
                  A mixed fighter fleet can provide the same or equivalent capability, but not without significantly more aircraft and pilots.
                  Mixed fighter fleets comparable in size to the single fighter fleet will likely result in lower overall capability, at a higher cost.
                  http://www.forces.gc.ca/en/about-rep...-fleet-en.page

                  Comment


                    #10
                    Right, so I'll post here in stead; I found this link on https://twitter.com/gripennews, & though it might be worth linking here: http://dailycaller.com/2016/01/22/am...-35-nightmare/

                    Comment


                      #11
                      Originally posted by velociraptor View Post
                      Right, so I'll post here in stead; I found this link on https://twitter.com/gripennews, & though it might be worth linking here: http://dailycaller.com/2016/01/22/am...-35-nightmare/
                      Yeah, I figured someone would bring that here sooner or later. A perfect example of "journalism" on the internet these days. Just make up whatever numbers you want and throw them on a chart, instant credibility.

                      Click image for larger version

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                      So let me see if I have this right...

                      The F-15 has lower instantaneous turn performance than the F-35A... meanwhile the F/A-18 has higher sustained turn performance than the F-15. (huh?)

                      The Su-27 has worse instantaneous turn performance than an Su-35, but the same sustained (?)... the Su-35 meanwhile is crushed in both metrics by all Eurocanards and the F-22 (again??). The Gripen of course is the top performer in both instantaneous and sustained turn performance.

                      In fact, if this chart is to be believed the Gripen can sustain sustain just shy of a 30 degree per second turn, more than the F-15/16/18/35 or Su-27 can achieve in a max instantaneous turn.

                      If this chart were even slightly accurate the Gripen would be flying circles around everything else in the sky...

                      Comment


                        #12
                        Originally posted by hopsalot View Post
                        If this chart were even slightly accurate the Gripen would be flying circles around everything else in the sky...
                        Yes, these values are ridiculous. Here's another source that I found in 3 seconds with Google (for Gripen C):
                        • Maximum instantaneous turn rate: 30 degrees/second
                        • Maximum sustained turn rate: 20 degrees/second


                        Now this seems a little bit more realistic...

                        Comment


                          #13
                          i recall the pilot of the demonstrator saying gripen NG could easily be touted as a 10G fighter

                          Comment


                            #14
                            Bulgaria to acquire new fighters

                            The minister said the government is likely to sign a deal to acquire new multirole fighter jets by the end of this year. According to earlier reports, to date, the Bulgarian Defense Ministry has shortlisted three offers. These include the US F-16s, which were withdrawn from service; Sweden's Gripen and the Eurofighter Typhoon.
                            http://www.defensenews.com/story/def...2019/79174700/

                            SAAB is in with the best chance IMO (unless politics favour buying from US). Typhoon too expensive to procure+operate; second hand US F-16's very costly to upgrade.
                            Sum ergo cogito

                            Comment


                              #15
                              Originally posted by Spitfire9 View Post
                              Bulgaria to acquire new fighters



                              http://www.defensenews.com/story/def...2019/79174700/

                              SAAB is in with the best chance IMO (unless politics favour buying from US). Typhoon too expensive to procure+operate; second hand US F-16's very costly to upgrade.
                              Depends how much they want to upgrade them. If all they are doing is air policing then I am sure they will be sufficient.

                              We agree on the Typhoon though. In a contest along with Gripen and used F-16s it does look a little odd.

                              Comment


                                #16
                                Originally posted by hopsalot View Post
                                We agree on the Typhoon though. In a contest along with Gripen and used F-16s it does look a little odd.
                                There was some talk of second hand Italian airframes... Even then, by comparison the maintenance costs will almost certainly be too much for the Bulgarian budget.
                                sigpic

                                Comment


                                  #17
                                  Wasn't Bulgaria gonna buy F-16s from Holland?

                                  Comment


                                    #18
                                    Originally posted by JakobS View Post
                                    Wasn't Bulgaria gonna buy F-16s from Holland?
                                    Sold to Jordan I believe. Some of them passed on Pakistan later.

                                    Comment


                                      #19
                                      "Operate 2 types? Why?"

                                      They might be thinking of cost and numbers of aircraft's. If they choose an expensive type of aircraft they could only get 30 and maybe they need other Hangars and landing strips etc . I know they have a lot of road bases, they might wanna use in i war scenario for example.Maybe they choose a smaller number say f-35 and a bigger number say Gripen. Since Gripen are very different to f-35, Gripen are proven/mature for road bases and used to cold and a fast interceptor/dog fighter/surveillance and the other a stealth expert better used as preemptive strike or silent surveillance. Gripen is much cheaper to fly around with in peace time and all things regarding gripen can be backed up in Sweden, weapons, repairs, advanced simulator training etc (they could even hide a few aircraft's in Sweden or just as to borrow some in case of need)

                                      Comment


                                        #20
                                        From 12 - 11.30.2015, Air China and Thailand have held exercises at a base on Thai soil, the Chinese side bring J-11 to attend the host country also use this type of fight its most advanced engine is JAS-39C / D Gripen .

                                        In addition, the PLA also sent both tumbling Bat squadron equipped with the most famous fighter J-10 next to perform.

                                        The exercises showed fatal weakness of the J-11 fighter compared to the West, it is the Chinese aircraft always have time to take off later than the Gripen C / D to 1 minute when using the same road ice.

                                        Besides the unreasonable is shown in the training, can not deny that the domestic engine performance equip J-11 is not as advertised, leading to losses in combat trousers round.

                                        Thus, we can see that the most advanced fighters of the Chinese Air Force is still a certain gap when compared with the European aircraft manufacturer.
                                        Significantly, JAS-39 Gripen is being seen as a bright candidate to replace the role of the MiG-21, new "retired" in the Air Force Vietnam.

                                        With great expression in the field, clear Gripen fighter scored in the eyes of observers, prospects are Vietnam choices and thus become very much clearer.
                                        Google translated from: http://soha.vn/quan-su/ap-dao-hoan-t...2814462281.htm

                                        One better keep the combat trousers on!

                                        Comment


                                         

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