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SAAB Gripen and Gripen NG thread #4

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  • Lolek
    Rank 5 Registered User
    • Oct 2016
    • 55

    Originally posted by Loke View Post
    To compare the Gripen E to F-16 block 50:

    Gripen E: Length 15.2m, Width 8.6m, Wing Area: 31 m2, empty weight 8,000kg, max internal fuel 3,400kg, MTOW 16,500kg*
    F-16 bl50: Length 15.06m, Width 9.96m, Wing Area 27.9m2, empty weight 8,570kg, max internal fuel 3,200kg, MTOW 19,200kg

    Gripen is has grown to be roughly in the same class as the F-16 block 50. The main concern I would have for the Gripen E is if the engine is powerful enough.

    (of course F-16 block 60/70 has also grown compared to block 50....)

    *(recent sources claim 17,000kg)
    It really bothers me - where did that additional 1.1m of length go? When looking at the pictures of Gripen E, I really don't see a change in proportions of the main fuselage in comparison to JAS-39C...and 1.1m is a lot, especially for such a small fighter.

    Comment

    • JakobS
      Rank 5 Registered User
      • Aug 2015
      • 155

      Follower to Gripen released, prototype planned for 2025

      Click image for larger version

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      Comment

      • obligatory
        Senior Member
        • Oct 2008
        • 7043

        apart from air intake and timeline, i could have bought into it

        Comment

        • Halo
          Rank 5 Registered User
          • Apr 2009
          • 212

          Originally posted by Loke View Post
          Same news but in English:


          Not a word about reduced RCS...

          Anyway, my guess is that the JSM will probably be fitted to Gripen if Finland (against all odds) purchase the Gripen E.

          Yes, reduced signature too, but no mentioning of complementary IR seeker as planned for MK4. Don't know how much RBS 15 MK3+ compete with JSM/NSM as the later doesn't have any radar seeker and feature a 40% smaller warhead.

          http://www.forsvarsmakten.se/sv/aktu...obot-bestalld/

          Comment

          • Halo
            Rank 5 Registered User
            • Apr 2009
            • 212

            @JakobS, I would love to hear more about this on the other 364 days of the year...

            Comment

            • Kopyo-21
              Rank 5 Registered User
              • Jan 2009
              • 212

              Saab given contract to develop RBS15 ER
              http://alert5.com/2017/04/01/saab-gi...er/#more-61935

              Attached Files

              Comment

              • obligatory
                Senior Member
                • Oct 2008
                • 7043

                4 anti ship missile load out is impressive,
                will the new missile be able to strike ground targets ?

                Comment

                • MSphere
                  Senior Member
                  • Feb 2010
                  • 8983

                  First time I have noted this.. is the IRST ball off the axis of the aircraft?

                  Comment

                  • bring_it_on
                    2005-year of the RAPTOR!!
                    • Jun 2004
                    • 12480

                    Originally posted by obligatory View Post
                    4 anti ship missile load out is impressive,
                    will the new missile be able to strike ground targets ?
                    Yes they are working on dual use capability for the upgraded variant as well much like its other two likely western competitors (JSM and Harpoon).
                    Old radar types never die; they just phased array

                    Comment

                    • Sintra
                      Rank 5 Registered User
                      • Aug 2007
                      • 3849

                      Originally posted by MSphere View Post
                      First time I have noted this.. is the IRST ball off the axis of the aircraft?
                      Yes
                      sigpic

                      Comment

                      • hopsalot
                        Senior Member
                        • Aug 2012
                        • 3166

                        Originally posted by obligatory View Post
                        4 anti ship missile load out is impressive,
                        will the new missile be able to strike ground targets ?
                        It had better be given that that Gripen couldn't likely fly much past the airfield fence in that loadout.

                        Comment

                        • Sintra
                          Rank 5 Registered User
                          • Aug 2007
                          • 3849

                          Originally posted by hopsalot View Post
                          It had better be given that that Gripen couldn't likely fly much past the airfield fence in that loadout.


                          The Swedish chaps have thought of that, the Flygvapnet air Base at Lulea is right besides the Baltic sea.
                          Last edited by Sintra; 3rd April 2017, 18:21.
                          sigpic

                          Comment

                          • JSR
                            JSR
                            Rank 5 Registered User
                            • Aug 2011
                            • 4977

                            Originally posted by obligatory View Post
                            4 anti ship missile load out is impressive,
                            will the new missile be able to strike ground targets ?
                            It still look like subsonic missile with high rcs Aircraft launch speed and altitude important for maximum range. Gripen is simply not capable of saturated attack and afterburner escape. There is no EW pods either.

                            Comment

                            • Loke
                              Rank 5 Registered User
                              • Jun 2008
                              • 3302

                              Originally posted by hopsalot View Post
                              It had better be given that that Gripen couldn't likely fly much past the airfield fence in that loadout.
                              LOL.

                              I think Gripen will do much better than that for the following reasons:

                              1. The new RBS-15 will be much lighter (and presumably also smaller) than the current RBS-15.

                              2. Gripen E has grown quite a lot since Gripen C; if you look at my previous post, it is now (compared to F-16 block 50) roughly the same length, empty weight is approx. 600 kg less but still carries 200kg more internal fuel than the F-16 block 50.

                              Of course Gripen E will still remain a small fighter so range will probably drop considerably when carrying so many missiles, but at least it will have a significantly better "starting point" than the current Gripen.
                              Last edited by Loke; 4th April 2017, 06:32.

                              Comment

                              • hopsalot
                                Senior Member
                                • Aug 2012
                                • 3166

                                Originally posted by Loke View Post
                                LOL.

                                I think Gripen will do much better than that for the following reasons:

                                1. The new RBS-15 will be much lighter (and presumably also smaller) than the current RBS-15.

                                2. Gripen E has grown quite a lot since Gripen C; if you look at my previous post, it is now (compared to F-16 block 50) roughly the same length, empty weight is approx. 600 kg less but still carries 200kg more internal fuel than the F-16 block 50.

                                Of course Gripen E will still remain a small fighter so range will probably drop considerably when carrying so many missiles, but at least it will have a significantly better "starting point" than the current Gripen.
                                Gripen E will have a greater load carrying capacity than Gripen C by virtue of its increased fuel load and more powerful engine, but the loadout depicted in that picture still won't be a realistic one.

                                That isn't a knock on the Gripen, more a comment on the silliness of those sorts of publicity shots.

                                Comment

                                • Loke
                                  Rank 5 Registered User
                                  • Jun 2008
                                  • 3302

                                  The A-Darter missile, developed by companies in Brazil and South Africa, broke out at the certification testing stage. According to the project manager, Lieutenant-Colonel Anderson Moreira of the Brazilian Air Force (FAB), this is "practically the last phase" of weapons development. The tests are expected to take place this year on the African continent.


                                  "The development trials are now closed and we are now preparing to prove to the certifying authorities that the product works according to the manufacturers' specifications and meeting customer requirements," says Moreira.

                                  The A-Darter is an air-to-air missile, designed to combat aircraft. As the FAB explains, it is a fifth-generation, infra-red, short-range armament between 8 and 12 km.
                                  Google translated from: http://airway.uol.com.br/desenvolvid...ase-de-testes/

                                  Comment

                                  • Loke
                                    Rank 5 Registered User
                                    • Jun 2008
                                    • 3302

                                    Originally posted by hopsalot View Post
                                    Gripen E will have a greater load carrying capacity than Gripen C by virtue of its increased fuel load and more powerful engine, but the loadout depicted in that picture still won't be a realistic one.

                                    That isn't a knock on the Gripen, more a comment on the silliness of those sorts of publicity shots.
                                    OK, got it

                                    The Saab Marketing people have also in the past made similar unrealistic graphics generated images -- I wonder why nobody within Saab tell them to just stop doing it. To the uninformed it may look impressive but to people that know a thing or two it does indeed look very silly...

                                    Comment

                                    • garryA
                                      Rank 5 Registered User
                                      • Dec 2015
                                      • 1120

                                      Those kind of picture looks cool af though

                                      Comment

                                      • Loke
                                        Rank 5 Registered User
                                        • Jun 2008
                                        • 3302

                                        Gripen out for a drive:

                                        https://twitter.com/FVC_Flygvapench/...95268946935809

                                        Gripen on the countryside:

                                        https://www.instagram.com/p/BSa7Wy-hRe2/

                                        Comment

                                        • JSR
                                          JSR
                                          Rank 5 Registered User
                                          • Aug 2011
                                          • 4977

                                          Originally posted by Loke View Post
                                          LOL.

                                          I think Gripen will do much better than that for the following reasons:

                                          1. The new RBS-15 will be much lighter (and presumably also smaller) than the current RBS-15.

                                          2. Gripen E has grown quite a lot since Gripen C; if you look at my previous post, it is now (compared to F-16 block 50) roughly the same length, empty weight is approx. 600 kg less but still carries 200kg more internal fuel than the F-16 block 50.

                                          Of course Gripen E will still remain a small fighter so range will probably drop considerably when carrying so many missiles, but at least it will have a significantly better "starting point" than the current Gripen.
                                          Gripen is clearly overweight for its engine power. and draggier weopon load will make it more uncompetitive. it just cant provide the altitude and accelaration for missile shots.

                                          Comment

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