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SAAB Gripen and Gripen NG thread #4

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  • Halo
    Rank 5 Registered User
    • Apr 2009
    • 212

    Originally posted by The_5aab_God View Post
    possible, though not likely. typically aircraft get heavier as they age...



    You know who else was going to use simulators to cut down on cost and time?
    I know, your favorite pet airplane, some airforces who plan for your pet plan to cut flying a lot too, the pilots will end up playing computer games with Top Speed rather than flying

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    • The_5aab_God
      Rank 5 Registered User
      • Mar 2015
      • 161

      Originally posted by MSphere View Post
      Why would they ever need to deal with S-400?
      Why did the pilot mention it? And couldn't the Gripen NG in theory be sold to a nation (exported if you will) that might have that concern?

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      • The_5aab_God
        Rank 5 Registered User
        • Mar 2015
        • 161

        Originally posted by Halo View Post
        , the pilots will end up playing computer games with Top Speed rather than flying

        Out of curiousity, What games have the Gripen NG pilots been playing all these years as they all wait for a chance to fly it even once?

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        • The_5aab_God
          Rank 5 Registered User
          • Mar 2015
          • 161

          Originally posted by Halo View Post
          @The:5aab_God, well, you are mixing 2 things, one is setting the structure, this usually brings weight loss and the other is more avionics and requirements that add weight LATER.
          So Saab over engineered the structure on the prototype?

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          • Halo
            Rank 5 Registered User
            • Apr 2009
            • 212

            So Saab over engineered the structure on the prototype?

            Would be strange if they started with a structure on the weak side and hope that strength / vibrations "would be ok".

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            • Ozair
              Rank 5 Registered User
              • Oct 2015
              • 822

              Originally posted by Halo View Post
              So Saab over engineered the structure on the prototype?

              Would be strange if they started with a structure on the weak side and hope that strength / vibrations "would be ok".
              Not really, It is pretty common in aerospace to engineer just enough strength into the airframe. Look for example at the civilian side of things with Boeing and Airbus either failing just short or just over their testing of wing load targets. The A380 failed within 3% of the wing load test. I don’t recall the A380 wing requiring a re-test, just some validation that strengthening had been applied to the right places.

              Therefore, it is often easier to add a couple of pounds of reinforcement to the wing or structure to reach the limit than remove it when the structure has far exceeded the design specification. F-35C wing is another example with a half a pound of additional strengthening required to get the wing to the full 8,000 hr minimum design limit.

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              • hopsalot
                Senior Member
                • Aug 2012
                • 3166

                Originally posted by Ozair View Post
                Not really, It is pretty common in aerospace to engineer just enough strength into the airframe. Look for example at the civilian side of things with Boeing and Airbus either failing just short or just over their testing of wing load targets. The A380 failed within 3% of the wing load test. I dont recall the A380 wing requiring a re-test, just some validation that strengthening had been applied to the right places.

                Therefore, it is often easier to add a couple of pounds of reinforcement to the wing or structure to reach the limit than remove it when the structure has far exceeded the design specification. F-35C wing is another example with a half a pound of additional strengthening required to get the wing to the full 8,000 hr minimum design limit.

                As the old saying goes... any idiot can build a bridge that will stay up. It takes a civil engineer to build a bridge that will barely stay up.

                The same principle applies to aviation obviously... simply throwing more weight/material at a problem is not the mark of a good engineering team. You always want to leave a margin for error and degradation over time, but everything past that is just dead weight.

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                • Loke
                  Rank 5 Registered User
                  • Jun 2008
                  • 3302

                  Committee recommendations will eventually be subject to a vote in the Bulgarian National Assembly.

                  Saab has been trying to sell Gripen to Bulgaria for several years. In 2006 a proposal was about 16 aircraft to the country, in response to a formal request and with several financing proposals. In the same year opened the Saab Gripen and a representative office in Sofia.

                  In the current process, where 16 planes still is what is on the agenda, is under the defense-aerospace two options alongside Griffin: Eurofighter and used American F-16s, planes now owned by Bulgaria's NATO Alliance Partner Portugal.

                  Eurofighter plane are regarded as too expensive by officials in the Defense Ministry, according to the news site, so the choice really is between Gripen and the used planes.

                  The Bulgarian Air Force goes on to advocate new aircraft, then used these have a limited life and eventually becomes more expensive than new.
                  Google translated from: http://www.di.se/finansiell-informat...c-5f8913ff1013

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                  • Spitfire9
                    Rank 5 Registered User
                    • Jul 2008
                    • 2832

                    Originally posted by Loke View Post
                    IMO

                    means... Typhoon out
                    Means... F-16 still in
                    Means... Gripen still in and most likely choice
                    Sum ergo cogito

                    Comment

                    • APRichelieu
                      Rank 5 Registered User
                      • Mar 2016
                      • 149

                      Originally posted by PhantomII View Post
                      I thought the use of all of the three primary fuselage hardpoints (not counting the one for recce/targeting pods) for AAMs was interesting. I think the JAS-39 is an excellent airplane, and I hope to see it continue to do well on the export market. I look forward to the day I get to see one in person for the first time.
                      I saw the one crashing in the middle of Stockholm.
                      Went down a few 100 meters from my appartment.

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                      • MSphere
                        Senior Member
                        • Feb 2010
                        • 8983

                        ???? never heard of such crash

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                        • Gyllis1
                          Rank 5 Registered User
                          • May 2016
                          • 7

                          Originally posted by MSphere View Post
                          ???? never heard of such crash
                          August 1993, 39A crashed during a display.

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                          • alfawhiskeyrome
                            Rank 5 Registered User
                            • Jan 2010
                            • 149

                            Originally posted by Gyllis1 View Post
                            August 1993, 39A crashed during a display.
                            https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mkgShfxTzmo

                            at 2:41 and from different camera at 3:41

                            "On 8 August 1993, a production JAS 39A Gripen (serial number 39-102) crashed on the central Stockholm island of Lngholmen, near the Vsterbron bridge, when the aircraft stalled after a slow speed manoeuver during a display over the Stockholm Water Festival. The crash was, like the first one, caused by PIO, and caught on film. The pilot Rdestrm again ejected from the aircraft, and landed safely by parachute, though he became stuck in a tree. The aircraft fell to the ground and caught fire on impact. Despite large crowds of onlookers, only one person on the ground was injured, and the fire was soon put out."
                            A summary of the official crash report may be found at :
                            http://www.x-plane.org/home/urf/avia...t/gripcras.htm

                            Comment

                            • MSphere
                              Senior Member
                              • Feb 2010
                              • 8983

                              Ah, ok, the "Cobra crash", forgot about it.. Thanks..

                              Comment

                              • Loke
                                Rank 5 Registered User
                                • Jun 2008
                                • 3302

                                Bulgarian Parliament Approves Plan to Buy Fighter Jets, Warships

                                Lawmakers voted 123 to 29 with 4 abstentions to finance the purchase of eight or nine new or used fighter jets worth total of 1.5 billion lev, Speaker Tsetska Tsacheva said in Sofia on Thursday.
                                Swedish-made Saab Gripen C/D, used Eurofighter Tranche 1 or F-16 MLU aircraft are seen as most appropriate options after preliminary talks held by the government with suppliers, according to the plan.
                                856k US!? Or did I make a mistake in the conversion?

                                Read more: http://www.bloomberg.com/news/articl...-jets-warships

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                                • Loke
                                  Rank 5 Registered User
                                  • Jun 2008
                                  • 3302

                                  The Slovak Ministry of Defence (MoD) has announced it is rejecting the latest offer for the lease of eight Saab Gripen fighter aircraft made by the Swedish government.

                                  "For me it is unacceptable how the Swedes are negotiating with us from a legislative and legal perspective. The asking price is also unacceptable", recently appointed Slovak defence minister Peter Gajdos told the Slovak-language daily SME .
                                  however:

                                  Sources close to the Slovak MoD say this may simply be a tactic to pressure Sweden to lower the price on its bid to lease aircraft.
                                  Read more: http://www.janes.com/article/60913/s...n-gripen-lease

                                  Comment

                                  • Loke
                                    Rank 5 Registered User
                                    • Jun 2008
                                    • 3302

                                    Gripen, Rafale, Typhoon On Malaysian MRCA Wishlist

                                    Malaysia is in the final stages of studying companies that meet the Royal Malaysian Air Force's (RMAF's) multirole combat aircraft (MRCA) requirement to replace its ageing MiG-29 fighter aircraft.
                                    "Our focus is on a multi-role combat aircraft (MRCA) capable of performing various roles, among others, the role of air-to-air combat and air-to-surface attack," he said.
                                    Asked whether the RMAF would be purchasing new aircraft, he said the air force was now identifying several types of fighter aircraft among them the Gripen, Rafale and Typhoon.
                                    Read more: http://www.defenseworld.net/news/162...t#.V1CPCzV97IU

                                    Comment

                                    • TomcatViP
                                      Rank 5 Registered User
                                      • Nov 2011
                                      • 6108

                                      Originally posted by Loke View Post
                                      856k US!? Or did I make a mistake in the conversion?

                                      Read more: http://www.bloomberg.com/news/articl...-jets-warships
                                      Nearly 1b$

                                      Comment

                                      • MSphere
                                        Senior Member
                                        • Feb 2010
                                        • 8983

                                        Originally posted by Loke View Post
                                        856k US!? Or did I make a mistake in the conversion?
                                        $ 856 million

                                        Comment

                                        • Loke
                                          Rank 5 Registered User
                                          • Jun 2008
                                          • 3302

                                          Oops... thanks yes I see now that I made a mistake in the conversion... No more Italian pizza for me tonight.

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