Read the forum code of contact
By: - 11th August 2015 at 17:21 Permalink - Edited 1st January 1970 at 01:00
From the Red Air perspective
1.) One of the very cool aspects of a sandbox simulation like*CMANO*is its ability to jump into a Gods-eye view showing all sides, or even to switch sides. Let’s take a look at this scenario from the Flankers’ point of view.
2.) With my four Flankers spaced roughly 40 nautical miles apart, I am hoping that I can pick up an F-35 in our wide sweep. Intel has said there are F-35s in the Baltic — but where are they?
3.) Getting closer — but my radars are still not picking anything up.
4.) Meanwhile it is a very uncomfortable experience to be flying into a zone where stealth fighters have been reported. I have PESA radar and 40 missiles between us — but we still haven’t picked up a sniff of the F-35s.
By: - 11th August 2015 at 17:44 Permalink - Edited 1st January 1970 at 01:00
This has already been discussed few weeks ago..
By: - 11th August 2015 at 22:00 Permalink - Edited 1st January 1970 at 01:00
Do you have a link sir? Id hate for this to be bumped down over a personal agenda.
By: - 11th August 2015 at 22:28 Permalink - Edited 1st January 1970 at 01:00
Some things I found odd
One oddity, for example, is the gunpod which was included as the standard F-35B LO air superiority load-out with four internal Meteor missiles.The gunpod is primarily for A2G and is certainly not "standard F-35B LO air superiority load-out". Given that, how did the gunpod affect maneuverability and detection range?
9.) At about 76 nautical miles away I finally am able to classify the threat as an F-35 using my IRST.
Published info from the mfg says <=35km for detection range, let alone identifying it as a F-35. No way in hell you ID it at 76nm (140km) which is greater than 4x the listed detection range.
Forget tracking it till you get to 20km thanks to your short ranged laser rangefinder.
AWACS was able to direct the F-35s to classify the hostiles as Su-35s at a range of around 96 nautical miles using their passive ETOS.In the same spirit as above, forget an IRST at 96nm. They could do it safely with radar & ESW at that range however.
Lastly, it seemed to not treat the F-35's LPI radar any differently than the SU-35's and did not talk about the F-35's jamming capability at all.
OLS IRST info here --> https://defenseissues.wordpress.com/2013/12/28/ols-35-irst/
By: - 11th August 2015 at 22:58 Permalink - Edited 1st January 1970 at 01:00
I find it amusing that you focus on a detail like gunpod but completely ignore that the F-35s are using Meteors which are not integrated yet.. and cannot be integrated in the current version, anyway..
How about the effect of maintenance on the RCS? Do you expect the F-35s having the nominal RCS values at all times? Forget it.
By: - 11th August 2015 at 23:09 Permalink - Edited 1st January 1970 at 01:00
I had assumed that he was talking about a Block 4 timeframe since there are not that many SU-35s flying anytime soon anyways.
On the RCS issue, just like all the other KPPs, the RCS spec is what it needs to be "after" a lifetime of use.
By: - 11th August 2015 at 23:11 Permalink - Edited 1st January 1970 at 01:00
Do you have a link sir? Id hate for this to be bumped down over a personal agenda.
I think it's either in this
http://forum.keypublishing.com/showthread.php?134882-F-35-News-Multimedia-amp-Discussion-thread-(2015)-Take-two/page33&highlight=simulation
or this
http://forum.keypublishing.com/showthread.php?135460-test-pilot-quot-F-35-can-t-dogfight-quot/page31&highlight=simulation
thread
Try using the search function of this forum. I remember that someone has expanded the sim using PAK-FA, as well.
By: - 11th August 2015 at 23:15 Permalink - Edited 1st January 1970 at 01:00
I had assumed that he was talking about a Block 4 timeframe since there are not that many SU-35s flying anytime soon anyways.
On the RCS issue, just like all the other KPPs, the RCS spec is what it needs to be "after" a lifetime of use.
I have seen many weapons planned for Block 4 integration.. SDB-II, JSM, even B61-12.. But METEOR was not among them.. In fact, METEOR is not yet planned for any Block.
KPP doesn't mean squat.. What matters is practical experience. IMHO, the F-35s will spend a great portion of their life flying with subnominal RCS values because the users will find the RCS treatment a good place to start saving on maintenance cost..
By: - 11th August 2015 at 23:48 Permalink - Edited 1st January 1970 at 01:00
I have seen many weapons planned for Block 4 integration.. SDB-II, JSM, even B61-12.. But METEOR was not among them.. In fact, METEOR is not yet planned for any Block.It's tentatively scheduled for Block 4. I say "tentatively" because at this time there is no "official" Block4 list of features but Meteor is on the latest graphic of Block 4.2 or 4.3 potential upgrades.
KPP doesn't mean squat.. What matters is practical experience.Current experience has shown that the VLO of the F-35 is VERY robust and relatively easy to maintain, especially in relation tot he F-117, B-2, and F-22.
IMHO, the F-35s will spend a great portion of their life flying with subnominal RCS values because the users will find the RCS treatment a good place to start saving on maintenance cost..That's your opinion.. What makes you think the maintenance for the SU-35 will fair any better considering that their economy is in the middle of a tailspin brought on by the downturn in global oil prices that was just exacerbated by China's devaluation of it's Yuan?
By: - 12th August 2015 at 00:05 Permalink - Edited 1st January 1970 at 01:00
It's tentatively scheduled for Block 4. I say "tentatively" because at this time there is no "official" Block4 list of features but Meteor is on the latest graphic of Block 4.2 or 4.3 potential upgrades.In short, METEOR has nothing lost there.. It's not any more real than RVV-BD on the Su-35S.
Current experience has shown that the VLO of the F-35 is VERY robust and relatively easy to maintain, especially in relation tot he F-117, B-2, and F-22.Sure.. they also said that the F-35 was flying almost like a Raptor..
That's your opinion.. What makes you think the maintenance for the SU-35 will fair any better considering that their economy is in the middle of a tailspin brought on by the downturn in global oil prices that was just exacerbated by China's devaluation of it's Yuan?Maintenance on the Su-35S hardly has any adverse effect on the RCS.. Can't say the same on the F-35. Lab values are nice but the real world is a different story..
By: - 12th August 2015 at 00:11 Permalink - Edited 1st January 1970 at 01:00
Maint on the SU-35S will not only affect it's RCS, but also it's radar, missiles, avionics, and engines.
Btw, I am talking real world RCS, not lab values for the F-35.
The F-22 is doing just fine RCS-wise and the F-35 is much easier than the F-22. In fact, the F-22 is borrowing some of the F-35's RCS tech to help lower it's own costs and raise it's availability rate.
By: - 12th August 2015 at 00:36 Permalink - Edited 1st January 1970 at 01:00
Maint on the SU-35S will not only affect it's RCS, but also it's radar, missiles, avionics, and engines.
Nor the F-35 or any other aircraft are an exception here.. You cannot save on engines without affecting the safety... But you can afford to fly some of your machines without a fully functioning radar, with the exception of QRA birds (a common practice in many air forces on a tight budget).. Even more you can afford to relax on the RCS treatment without affecting your combat readiness.. which is exactly what I predict will be happening with all stealth aircraft of the future..
Btw, I am talking real world RCS, not lab values for the F-35.You aren't talking about anything bcs you have no clue.. Even lab values are classified, let alone the degradation caused by external conditions. So, unless Mr.Axe is facing a trial for disclosing information falling under ITAR, he's pulling RCS figures out of thin air.. no pun intended, it's not worth it even if he knew.. but it really shows a value of such "simulation"..
The F-22 is doing just fine RCS-wise and the F-35 is much easier than the F-22. In fact, the F-22 is borrowing some of the F-35's RCS tech to help lower it's own costs and raise it's availability rate.Of course it's doing fine.. Most air forces don't openly disclose even their readiness rates but you can trumpet to the whole world the RCS variance data of USAF F-22s during their lifetime.. in reality, you have no clue...
This discussion didn't have much sense from the very beginning but now it's being a complete waste of time, sorry..
By: - 12th August 2015 at 01:12 Permalink - Edited 1st January 1970 at 01:00
It's tentatively scheduled for Block 4. I say "tentatively" because at this time there is no "official" Block4 list of features but Meteor is on the latest graphic of Block 4.2 or 4.3 potential upgrades.
Current experience has shown that the VLO of the F-35 is VERY robust and relatively easy to maintain, especially in relation tot he F-117, B-2, and F-22.
That's your opinion.. What makes you think the maintenance for the SU-35 will fair any better considering that their economy is in the middle of a tailspin brought on by the downturn in global oil prices that was just exacerbated by China's devaluation of it's Yuan?
Russia is trade surplus country like Germany, Saudi, China, Korea with even better low debt and low unemployment with ownership society of housing. It doesnot need go to foreign bond market. Global warming is making it better. I think they are going to spend even more on military than any one else. discouraging imports.
http://sputniknews.com/russia/20150811/1025630923.html
By: - 12th August 2015 at 01:38 Permalink - Edited 1st January 1970 at 01:00
Msphere read the article again. David said that even with Amraam C the outcome was the same. Nice try.
By: - 12th August 2015 at 01:48 Permalink - Edited 1st January 1970 at 01:00
Russia's economy shrank by 4.6% in the second quarter of this year, posting the worst performance since the crippling recession of 2009, the state statistics agency reported Monday.
http://www.latimes.com/world/europe/la-fg-russia-economy-contracts-20150810-story.html
Russia’s economy contracted by 4.6 per cent in the second quarter compared with the same period in 2014, the largest drop in six years, marking the country’s first recession since the financial crisis in 2009.According to figures published last month, the slide in consumer spending deepened in the second quarter with retail sales falling by 9.4 per cent in June. Growth in the industrial sector, which had been flat in the first three months of the year, also dropped by almost 5 per cent in the second quarter.
“With oil prices having fallen further over the past few months it remains too soon to speak about a recovery,” said Liza Ermolenko, an analyst with Capital Economics.
http://www.ft.com/cms/s/0/a4b9944c-3f77-11e5-b98b-87c7270955cf.html#axzz3iYbTt4kc
Battered by a combination of falling oil prices, the ruble devaluation and sanctions imposed following the Ukrainian conflict, Russia's economy contracted by 4.6 percent in the second quarter compared with a year earlier, according to the country's statistics office. After a decline of 2.2 percent in the previous quarter, this marks Russia's deepest recession since the 2008-2009 financial crisis.http://www.cnbc.com/2015/08/11/russias-economy-is-in-a-pit-according-to-economists.html
You're right.. they are doing just fine :eek:
By: - 12th August 2015 at 01:49 Permalink - Edited 1st January 1970 at 01:00
Msphere read the article again. TIM ROBINSON said that even with Amraam C the outcome was the same. Nice try.
FIFY
By: - 12th August 2015 at 02:41 Permalink - Edited 1st January 1970 at 01:00
http://www.latimes.com/world/europe/la-fg-russia-economy-contracts-20150810-story.htmlhttp://www.ft.com/cms/s/0/a4b9944c-3f77-11e5-b98b-87c7270955cf.html#axzz3iYbTt4kc
http://www.cnbc.com/2015/08/11/russias-economy-is-in-a-pit-according-to-economists.html
You're right.. they are doing just fine :eek:
Unless you show me there central bank balance sheet, credit to consumers, both liquid and illiquid assets buying by foreigners. Firms , education.and agriculture dependency on foreign labor. decline of education system. All this thing can contribute to dysfuctiinal state that is unable to take right decisions. This 5% decline is meaningless number .
By: - 12th August 2015 at 03:32 Permalink - Edited 1st January 1970 at 01:00
KPP doesn't mean squat.. What matters is practical experience. IMHO, the F-35s will spend a great portion of their life flying with subnominal RCS values because the users will find the RCS treatment a good place to start saving on maintenance cost..
Raptor to use F-35 radar absorbent coatingsThe newest F-22 stealth fighters produced at Lockheed Martin's Marietta, Ga., factory have improved radar absorbent coatings derived from the company's F-35 Joint Strike Fighter program.
"Some of the [low observables] coatings system and gap-fillers that the F-35 had an advantage on, we have incorporated into the Raptor," said Jeff Babione, vice president and general manager of the F-22 program for Lockheed Martin.
By: - 12th August 2015 at 03:38 Permalink - Edited 1st January 1970 at 01:00
http://www.latimes.com/world/europe/la-fg-russia-economy-contracts-20150810-story.html
http://www.ft.com/cms/s/0/a4b9944c-3f77-11e5-b98b-87c7270955cf.html#axzz3iYbTt4kc
http://www.cnbc.com/2015/08/11/russias-economy-is-in-a-pit-according-to-economists.htmlYou're right.. they are doing just fine :eek:
Don't engage him. JSR is like a bad rash. Its tempting to scratch it but that only makes things worse.
By: - 12th August 2015 at 04:41 Permalink - Edited 1st January 1970 at 01:00
about the same result as the Gripen vs Su-35 simulation,
with the difference that the Meteor used in Gripen sim is integrated and exist,
while the Meteor version in this F-35 sim is a paper missile, and as a spin-off, not integrated either
Posts: 572
By: Jessmo23 - 11th August 2015 at 17:18
https://medium.com/war-is-boring/don-t-think-the-f-35-can-fight-it-does-in-this-realistic-war-game-fc10706ba9f4
Courtesy of David Axe. This could be an olive branch to F-35 supporters.
4.0and 3.0 to 1 Ratio in favor of the F-35