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  • Berkut
    Senior Member
    • Nov 2011
    • 2216

    No. Yes.

    Comment

    • Twinblade
      Rank 5 Registered User
      • Apr 2011
      • 1846

      Originally posted by Berkut View Post
      Not only that, look closer.
      Interesting. Different positioning of the rearward facing jammer compared to Indian upgrade.
      sigpic

      Comment

      • TR1
        TR1
        http://tiny.cc/tp8kd
        • Oct 2010
        • 9826

        Always been a Kamov fan, but I must say the Mi-28N is growing on me, especially in the new scheme.

        http://russianplanes.net/images/to101000/100131.jpg.jpg
        http://russianplanes.net/images/to101000/100130.jpg.jpg

        Now if only Mil would catch up to Kamov in defense systems.
        sigpic

        Comment

        • TR1
          TR1
          http://tiny.cc/tp8kd
          • Oct 2010
          • 9826

          http://img13.imageshost.ru/img/2013/...7793e2ab7e.jpg

          On second thought, nope, still Ka-52 fanboy.
          sigpic

          Comment

          • Jō Asakura
            多聞天
            • Jan 2011
            • 1302

            Big Bad Vlad visits NAPO:

            http://foto.rg.ru/photos/af7bac8b/1.html

            SSJ assembly @ KnAAPO:

            http://fotografersha.livejournal.com/367125.html
            sigpic

            Comment

            • mack8
              Rank 5 Registered User
              • Nov 2009
              • 2114

              Originally posted by Berkut View Post
              Not only that, look closer.
              Ok i give up, what else? I can see the two small antennas under the wingtips like the indian UPG, but i can't notice anything else. (oh and the GLITs badge)
              --------------
              NO to NATO
              NO to WAR!

              Comment

              • Owlcat
                Rank 4 Registered User
                • Sep 2012
                • 254

                Originally posted by mack8 View Post
                Ok i give up, what else? I can see the two small antennas under the wingtips like the indian UPG, but i can't notice anything else. (oh and the GLITs badge)
                Faceted IRST housing.

                Comment

                • Vishal
                  Rank 5 Registered User
                  • Mar 2011
                  • 40

                  My Photo of RuAF IL76 at Yelahanka/Aero India 2013 supporting the Russian Knights http://www.airliners.net/photo/2235328/L/

                  Comment

                  • Kopyo-21
                    Rank 5 Registered User
                    • Jan 2009
                    • 212

                    Originally posted by Berkut View Post
                    Not only that, look closer.
                    agreed
                    - LWRs installed on many places instead of only on wing tips
                    - Podded RWR on wings like Mig-29UPG.

                    Comment

                    • Austin
                      Rank 5 Registered User
                      • Oct 2003
                      • 6506

                      Putin says Russia to spend five trillion rubles on planes, choppers


                      Russia is preparing to allocate about 5 trillion rubles ($163 billion), or a quarter of its rearmament program this decade, to modernize combat aviation units, President Vladimir Putin said.

                      The country plans to purchase about 2,000 planes and helicopters to bring the share of the latest weaponry to 70 percent of the total, up from 20 percent right now, Putin said at a government meeting in the Siberian city of Novosibirsk today.

                      Russia's plan to upgrade the military this decade comprises the largest rearmament program since the 1991 collapse of the Soviet Union.

                      "We have to completely re-equip our combat aviation," Putin said. "Our equipment should be better than foreign equivalents."
                      "A map does you no good if you don't know where you are"

                      Comment

                      • Austin
                        Rank 5 Registered User
                        • Oct 2003
                        • 6506

                        The Airforce budget seems to be revised or was it the same in SAP.

                        How will they get that kind of money and indeed the entire money for SAP of 20 Trillion roubles needs to be seen.

                        Some food for thought on SAP 2020 and why it might get revised.

                        http://periscope2.ru/2013/02/26/7007/
                        "A map does you no good if you don't know where you are"

                        Comment

                        • Rii
                          Rii
                          Senior Member
                          • Oct 2010
                          • 3449

                          Originally posted by JSR View Post
                          subsonic low g platform will be lighter and more longer life. so ability to carry more fuel/weopon load and hence more loiter time. loiter time is the most important criteria as you want significant strike capability patrolling continously for target of oppurtunity with most powerfull sensors/weopons. for example Fighter/tranport/air refueler aircraft on runway or launching barrage of missile on ships/sam installations.
                          I agree that if loiter time is a priority then a subsonic flying wing design is difficult to beat. But I question how this fits in with Russian plans and requirements. For a long-range bomber I was envisioning strategic targets such as factories, bridges, power stations, etc. Loitering in the vicinity of e.g. a carrier battle group strikes me as a risky proposition, involving a confidence verging on arrogance that is not in keeping with general Russian philosophy which tends to assume operating from position of weakness or vulnerability.
                          Last edited by Rii; 9th March 2013, 10:23.

                          Comment

                          • haavarla
                            Rank 5 Registered User
                            • Dec 2008
                            • 6715

                            Just read the Airforces Monthly.
                            There were a wopping 24 pages article on Russia Re-Arms.
                            Been a loong time since i read an article this outstanding!
                            God knows its a long time between a good VVS coverage.

                            Anyway, there is an complete list coverage all AB and its structure, ano 2013.
                            Awesome!
                            There might be some error here nd there, but we get the big picture.

                            Just want to point out a little here.

                            "By 2020 Russia plans to upgrade its remaining operational airfields.
                            Khalino haveing been completed in sept 2012. The infrastructure at Krymsk is being improved as we speak, and Runway upgrade work under way at Akhtubinsk, Chalovskiy and Engels just to name a few. Work is expected to begin at Voronezh earlier this year. Many other as well, but at a later timeframe."

                            "The Air Regiment has been replaced by the Air Base(AvB), a term used to describe a military unit(s), not an air base/ airfield.
                            Under the original reform plan of 2009, a total of 52 AvB of three different grade were formed, replacing 72 regiments, 14 AvB and 12 separate squadrons or detechments. The plan called for the establishment of three different categories of AvB.
                            1st grade was created from the merger of two or more former Air Regiments.
                            2nd grade was formed from the assets of atleast one former Air Regiment.
                            3rd grade would only have one Squadron attached.

                            However, this plan was revised in mid-2010, and all the 3rd grade AvB was axed, thereby reducing the total of AvB to total of 37.

                            All Squadrons was then formed into (aviatsionnaya groupa/ AvGr), and subordinated into existing AvB, or relocated into new AvB with the same types of units.
                            Each AvGr is made up of one or more Squadrons.

                            At the end of 2010 a new revision began. Exsiting AvBs were once again merged to form so-called 'Super-base' which left only the 1st grade AvBs left.
                            The st1 grade AvBs that remained, limited to Da(long range aviation), Ta(tactical aviation) and VTA(Transport aviation) units. Each of them now controls a number of AvGrs, some of which are located at seperated Airfields."

                            The only 2nd grade AvB remaining is AA(Army aviation) helicopter units.
                            Thanks

                            Comment

                            • Berkut
                              Senior Member
                              • Nov 2011
                              • 2216

                              Originally posted by mack8 View Post
                              Ok i give up, what else? I can see the two small antennas under the wingtips like the indian UPG, but i can't notice anything else. (oh and the GLITs badge)
                              Yes, i was talking about the antennas.

                              Originally posted by Owlcat View Post
                              Faceted IRST housing.
                              Funny joke.

                              Comment

                              • totoro
                                Rank 5 Registered User
                                • Apr 2006
                                • 1026

                                Originally posted by haavarla View Post

                                Anyway, there is an complete list coverage all AB and its structure, ano 2013.
                                wow, that sounds great. i am considering getting that issue solely for that info. still, an important question- does that complete coverage includes all of the individual squadrons within every AB or just Air bases themselves? I would really like to see a list which says:

                                xxxx AB - contains squadron yyy (such and such type of ac), squadron zzz (type) and squadron qqqq (type)

                                Comment

                                • Rii
                                  Rii
                                  Senior Member
                                  • Oct 2010
                                  • 3449

                                  So if only '1st Grade' bases are left, how many is that (less than 37, obviously) and what is the distribution like, e.g. how many bases in Far East?

                                  With the '2nd Grade' bases and so on, are there plans to maintain them at any level for dispersal in time of war, divert options, etc.?
                                  Last edited by Rii; 10th March 2013, 11:30.

                                  Comment

                                  • JSR
                                    JSR
                                    Rank 5 Registered User
                                    • Aug 2011
                                    • 4982

                                    Originally posted by Rii View Post
                                    I agree that if loiter time is a priority then a subsonic flying wing design is difficult to beat. But I question how this fits in with Russian plans and requirements. For a long-range bomber I was envisioning strategic targets such as factories, bridges, power stations, etc. Loitering in the vicinity of e.g. a carrier battle group strikes me as a risky proposition, involving a confidence verging on arrogance that is not in keeping with general Russian philosophy which tends to assume operating from position of weakness or vulnerability.
                                    loitering means several hundred kms from battlefield or aircraft carrier and use more powerfull sensors/jammers for survellence and battlefield management. they may also provide targeting information to Naval ships missiles. the point is somthing continously in air to keep an eye in sky and right away strike. you also to consider that advancements in cruise missiles speed/range/stealthness.
                                    see Libya example. if US had B-1 patrolling in Mediteranean. atleast it could respond in time. UCAV cannot lift those heavy sensors/ long range missiles and generally have slower speed.

                                    Comment

                                    • haavarla
                                      Rank 5 Registered User
                                      • Dec 2008
                                      • 6715

                                      Originally posted by totoro View Post
                                      wow, that sounds great. i am considering getting that issue solely for that info. still, an important question- does that complete coverage includes all of the individual squadrons within every AB or just Air bases themselves? I would really like to see a list which says:

                                      xxxx AB - contains squadron yyy (such and such type of ac), squadron zzz (type) and squadron qqqq (type)
                                      The list include under which Air Command each AvB is under.

                                      Let me give you an exsample;

                                      4th VVS/POV Command(Southern Military District) Rostov-on-Don:

                                      6972nd AvB Krymsk is one of those 1st grade super bases. Which contain:

                                      AvGr 6972nd AvB(Krymsk) Mi-8, Su-27/UB, Su-27SM, Su-30M2.
                                      AvGr 6972nd AvB(Millerovo) Mig-29/UB.
                                      AvGr 6972nd AvB(Primorosko/Akhtarsk) Su-25/UB
                                      AvGr 6972nd AvB(Rostov-on-Don) An-12, An-26, Mi-8, Il-20M, Il-22M, Tu-134
                                      AvGr 6972nd AvB(Morozovsk) Su-24, Su-24M
                                      AvGr 6972nd AvB(Budyonnovsk) Su-25/UB, Su-25SM
                                      AvGr 6972nd AvB(Marinovka) Su-24MR

                                      So one of those 1st grade Super bases can have both several AvGr from same Airfield or other airfields under its command.
                                      One AvGr can range from a old Regiment size(several Sq) and down to less than a Squadron size.
                                      The list state which type of units, but not how many.

                                      Originally posted by Rii View Post
                                      So if only '1st Grade' bases are left, how many is that (less than 37, obviously) and what is the distribution like, e.g. how many bases in Far East?

                                      With the '2nd Grade' bases and so on, are there plans to maintain them at any level for dispersal in time of war, divert options, etc.?
                                      The only 2nd grade AvB and AvGr left is Helicopter units. And transport/Cargo units, trainers and some special units like those in Lipetsk.
                                      I guess one reason is due to its not even Squadron sizes we are talking about, but only a handfull of units.

                                      The old Soviet-style-four-level Command hierarchy: Air Army/Air Division/Air Regiments/Squadron, has been abolished in favor of a more streamlined: three-level structure Operational Command, Air Base(AvB), Squadron(AvGr).
                                      Last edited by haavarla; 10th March 2013, 19:45.
                                      Thanks

                                      Comment

                                      • TR1
                                        TR1
                                        http://tiny.cc/tp8kd
                                        • Oct 2010
                                        • 9826

                                        http://aviaforum.ru/showpost.php?p=1...postcount=1122

                                        Il-476 cockpit.
                                        sigpic

                                        Comment

                                        • Austin
                                          Rank 5 Registered User
                                          • Oct 2003
                                          • 6506

                                          ^^ Not bad but An-70 cockpit looks far better and i suppose IL-476 is not a FBW aircraft ?

                                          So they have Pilot , Co-Pilot and Flight Engineer/NAvigator ? 3 Man cockpit or 4 ?
                                          "A map does you no good if you don't know where you are"

                                          Comment

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