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    Museum P40

    Just back from a mini-holiday.

    Spotted this in a museum.



    Moggy
    "What you must remember" Flip said "is that nine-tenths of Cattermole's charm lies beneath the surface." Many agreed.

    #2
    OK, do you want to tell us more - - or shall we play 20 questions ?

    ......though doubtless there will be at least one other person on here who already knows

    Comment


      #3
      Let's leave it floating for the moment and see what's suggested
      "What you must remember" Flip said "is that nine-tenths of Cattermole's charm lies beneath the surface." Many agreed.

      Comment


        #4
        That's some time capsule.
        Daren Cogdon

        Spitfire fanatic

        Comment


          #5
          Originally posted by Robbo
          Spoil-sport!

          Let's see more shots like this from 'interesting' places.

          Mark
          "...the story had been forensically examined and was deeply impressive. I knew that the whole story was a load of myth and baloney"

          Comment


            #6
            Moggy,

            I understood this aircraft was submerged in shallow salt water for something like 40 years, yet against the prevailing view among us all that salt recoveries from anything but oxygen depleted depths are not viable this airframe looks remarkably "clean" and solid despite that in your photographes(although I understand some damage was done to remove it quickly from the beach)

            Can you comment on its apparant condition ie corrosion etc from your inspection of the airframe? it doesnt appear to have significant new metal replaced?, has it undergone processes?? to counter the salt contained in the skin joints etc?

            thanks for the pics

            regards

            Mark Pilkington
            "Never has a Country so Big!, owed so Much!, to those who Flew!"

            Comment


              #7


              I believe it had undergone some stabilisation process immediately after recovery. But from what I can see much of the structure was original.

              Here is the other side

              Moggy
              "What you must remember" Flip said "is that nine-tenths of Cattermole's charm lies beneath the surface." Many agreed.

              Comment


                #8
                Plus this on the field at Albenga.



                Moggy
                "What you must remember" Flip said "is that nine-tenths of Cattermole's charm lies beneath the surface." Many agreed.

                Comment


                  #9
                  Moggy--

                  Oh MY, that's spectacular. I'd thought this P-40 had been set out in a crash diorama in a museum near the recovery location. Clearly not...and all things considered, what stunning condition it's in.

                  Nice two-seater "Gina", too.

                  S.

                  Comment


                    #10
                    Thanks for posting that Moggy

                    It's a very interesting pic... the aircraft looks amazing considering it's been in the sea for so long. There was a ki-27 that came out of the sea off Thailand which is in similar - seemingly - excellent condition. Do you have any more pics, or perhaps close ups?

                    Comment


                      #11
                      Originally posted by Steve T
                      Moggy--

                      Oh MY, that's spectacular. I'd thought this P-40 had been set out in a crash diorama in a museum near the recovery location.
                      No, you were quite correct. The museum is only a few miles from the Anzio beachead where it ditched due to an engine problem and, as you can see, there is a mural of the invasion fleet behind it, plus a mural of the beach in front of it, whilst it stands on sand.

                      "What you must remember" Flip said "is that nine-tenths of Cattermole's charm lies beneath the surface." Many agreed.

                      Comment


                        #12
                        Soon after recovery it was immersed in a bath to get the salt out. Seems to have worked very well. If a windshield can be found she looks magnificent. Something is missing................

                        Cees

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                          #13
                          I make no pretence to be a photographer. These are just hand-held happy-snaps with my three year old digi. Nearest I have to a close up is this of the engine. I can't believe there hasn't been some pretty extensive work done to this since it was raised.

                          Moggy

                          "What you must remember" Flip said "is that nine-tenths of Cattermole's charm lies beneath the surface." Many agreed.

                          Comment


                            #14
                            Is this the one that ditched due to overheating, from what turned out to be a parachute stuffed into the chin? And didn't they have to cut the wings off to get it off the beach in the time alotted by the "authorities"?

                            looks great, very interesting!

                            cheers

                            greg v

                            Comment


                              #15
                              Yes, and also had some skin panels buckled due to bad handling to get her off the beach.

                              Impressive exhibit

                              Cees

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                                #16
                                She is however a beautiful artifact that demonstrates what should be done to this type of recovery. If the P-40 as a type wasn't plentiful I would say restore her but she has survived very well and makes a fascinating exhibit.

                                Comment


                                  #17
                                  I like her this way!!

                                  While I normally prefer flying restorations, then good static restorations, there is just something so very "right" about the way they have done this display!

                                  This museum has my great respect, and appreciation for this wonderful job, which captures both the essence of this plane's service and the passing of time that has made such artifacts into much more than "just old airplanes"!
                                  Germany, Austria and Italy are standing together in the middle of the pub, when Serbia bumps into Austria, and spills Austria's pint.

                                  Comment


                                    #18
                                    Agree with Bager1968 & DB completely on this one. It's a fascinating timepiece, wonderful to study as it is.

                                    Also agree with Moggy, in that it looks as if there's been some work done to it (e.g. exhausts stubs), but not too much to detract from the 'time capsule' appearance.

                                    We need to see more like this! Thanks for posting Moggy.

                                    Comment


                                      #19
                                      Thanks for the thanks.

                                      I do agree with the bulk of opinion. Whilst there are a good few 'intact' P40s around this makes a fascinating exhibit in its almost-as-found state. It would have been a less impressive if fully restored, IMO

                                      Moggy
                                      "What you must remember" Flip said "is that nine-tenths of Cattermole's charm lies beneath the surface." Many agreed.

                                      Comment


                                        #20
                                        'Can you see what it is yet?'

                                        I'm surprised no-one's mentioned the key thing about this P-40, which apart from it's originality is its rarity; as I understand it (I'm open to correction - I'm no P-40 expert!) it's the surviving P-40L, 42-10857 - with the 'F' (essentially the same) the only production P-40 engined with anything than an Allison engine, and in fact with a Packard Merlin, an engine Britain's usually keen to extoll the advantages of!

                                        There were two P-40F survivors both recovered from Vanuatu. One is under rebuild to fly, where it will be unique, by Judy Pay's Old Aeroplane Company at Tyabb Victoria. The other was traded to the RNZAF museum who are configuring it as the more common P-40E - I have to say a strange decision, as, given the spares support for Merlin engines, a trade for a more appropriate model would be possible and wouldn't involve spaying a perfectly good P-40F into an E model. However, it's their aircraft.

                                        So, currently this is the only static P-40F/L or if you prefer, the only Merlin P-40 on display anywhere in the world, and with a combat history being downed in front of the beach at Anzio.

                                        I'd also like to publicly thank Moggy for supplying copies of his pics for me to pass onto the Tyabb team as they are currently plumbing their engine, and it's a challenge, not least of which the P-40F and L are very badly documented, as it's so rare. I doubt the data in the photos will provide a 'eureka' moment for the restorers, but it would be nice to hope it might, and as they say, every little helps.

                                        (The Merlin P-40 is easy to ID from the front as it has no carb-air intake on the top of the cowling, but one inside the chin intake, and the nose-intake area looks deeper than the other Allison versions. Some P-40F's had a small fillet in front of the fin, I'm informed.)

                                        Cheers
                                        James K

                                        Looking and thinking...
                                        Vintage Aero Writer: Blog & Details

                                        Comment


                                         

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