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"Vulcan in a roll"

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    "Vulcan in a roll"

    I have no idea if the photo below is a common one or not. I came across it recently in a 60-year old magazine and thought it might be of interest.
    Attached Files

    #2
    Ian

    Impressive but I suspect the image is upside down, the photo ship looks to be a C82/C119.

    Richard
    "Where are you from?"
    "America" Somebody laughed politely.

    Comment


      #3
      Inverted image sounds plausible:



      As per: The second production Avro Vulcan B1 XA890 - Media Storehouse

      Nice to see the clean(er) lines of a B1 Vulcan.

      Comment


        #4
        I wondered about that, which is why I included the caption.

        Is this what we now call 'fake news'?

        Comment


          #5
          Possibly true - but it looks a little too close to the camera aircraft to be throwing such a big machine about like that.

          Anon.

          Comment


            #6
            Looks fine to me, nice formation break. Probably Roly Falk or Jimmy Harrison or one of the other Avro TPs? Farnborough week late '50s and, as mentioned above, shot from the rear of the C-119 the RAE borrowed for some trials.
            Last edited by Hooligan; 6th December 2017, 22:37.

            Comment


              #7
              This was the nearest that I saw to a Vulcan roll. XH558 on leaving Little Gransden at the end of its display in 2014. This was one of its last displays.

              Graham


              Vulcan XH558 Little Gransden 2014

              Comment


                #8
                See this https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=afj19PedlxE

                Comment


                  #9
                  Great find. Thanks.

                  Comment


                    #10
                    If the 'Picture Library' picture in Post #3 shows the correct orientation - and that certainly fits with the photograph being taken through the 'open' (removed?) doors at the rear of a C-119 - then that original photo had to be 'flipped' not just vertically but also horizontally to achieve the photograph in Post #1, as published.

                    I guess it is possible that, when the negative was sent to the photo-lab for making photographs to be passed to the press for publication, it was placed the wrong way round in the printer by a lab technician who knew no better and that the error was not spotted by anyone along the way. If you are not familiar with the configuration of a C-119, the background is sufficiently "ambiguous" not to arouse concern - see next post.
                    Last edited by ianwoodward9; 7th December 2017, 16:06.

                    Comment


                      #11
                      Picture Library shot 'flipped' both vertically and horizontally:
                      Attached Files

                      Comment


                        #12
                        Ianwoodward9

                        On a C-119 the doors would have been removed.
                        Earlier, the USAF provided a C-82 to RAE as a photo platform.
                        There are two sides to every story. The truth is usually somewhere between the two.

                        Comment


                          #13
                          Can the rear doors on either a C-119 or C-82 be opened in flight? I've seen photos of paratroops jumping from both via smaller side doors, and images of both on the ground with the rear end of the fuselage opened up. Presumably the part of the camera ship we can see in the photo is one of the tail booms? If so, from where was the photo taken? Apologies but I'm sitting here with a Birra Moretti entirely failing to get my head around the logistics of the photo.

                          Comment


                            #14
                            Originally posted by Meddle
                            Apologies but I'm sitting here with a Birra Moretti entirely failing to get my head around the logistics of the photo.
                            Moretti is just Heineken these days - perhaps if you tried some decent beer your brain cell might comprehend better

                            Comment


                              #15
                              Originally posted by ianwoodward9
                              ......then that original photo had to be 'flipped' not just vertically but also horizontally..........the background is sufficiently "ambiguous" not to arouse concern....
                              I don't think there is any ambiguity at all; it is pretty obvious that the magazine image is a flipped version of the library image - all the features of both aircraft and the background sky are identical, and your flip of the library image confirms this 100%.

                              Even to an untrained eye, the attitude of the Vulcan in the magazine version of the image doesn't appear 'right': I am not sure why some appear to be having doubts about it to be honest.

                              Comment


                                #16
                                One Italian Heineken later... surely you can only assume so much about the attitude of the Vulcan without knowing the attitude of the camera ship?

                                While the original image has been flipped to add a sense of drama (presumably), I rather like it! Roly Falk, Farnborough, bombers handling like fighters 'n' all that.

                                Comment


                                  #17
                                  Well the C119 will not have been flying inverted - so that might give the viewer a clue.
                                  Almost every day we see images that have been flipped by mistake,you know the sort where the RAF pilots wings are worn above the right pocket,I did it myself some years ago with a Biggin Hill display picture LOL.

                                  Conversely - There is a lovely picture of Sqn Ldr George Ba5tard flying a canberra and pulling inverted away from the camera over a snowy background (B/W taken in the 50's/60's) which looks absolutely fantastic without any trickery involved.
                                  Last edited by bazv; 9th December 2017, 10:48.

                                  Comment


                                    #18
                                    I fully accept that the image has been flipped and reversed. I still don't understand where the photographer was located within a C-119 to be able to capture a length of one of the tail booms at that angle.

                                    Comment


                                      #19
                                      Meddle

                                      No, the large rear doors of C-82s and most C-119s can't be opened in flight because they are swinging clamshell affairs...rather like a rear facing Bristol Freighter. For photos like this, the doors are removed.

                                      There was a late modification to 67 C-119s with flat "beaver tail" doors that could be partially opened in flight. They were mainly used to snag reentry parachutes on early satellite payloads. Modified aircraft were C-119Js.
                                      There are two sides to every story. The truth is usually somewhere between the two.

                                      Comment


                                        #20
                                        Every time I see that thread title I think of chicken in a basket...

                                        Adrian
                                        "Snow clearing equipment has been found under snowdrift" - message sent from RNAS Hatston, Orkney, 1944.

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