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  • avion ancien
    Rank 5 Registered User
    • Aug 2007
    • 5196

    Shuttleworth Trust Aero Engines

    Ive searched, in vain, for an online source which provides a definitive list of the aero engines in the Shuttleworth Collection, both attached to and detached from aeroplanes, manufactured by ABC, Blackburne, Douglas & Scott (and, to a lesser extent, J.A.Prestwich and British Anzani). Does anyone know of a comprehensive online source of this information? If so, Id be very grateful for a hyperlink to that. Alternatively, can anyone supply this information from their own knowledge or records? I have asked the Shuttleworth Trust but a week has passed without any reply from it.
  • Anon
    Mike Davey
    • Jan 2008
    • 2829

    #2
    Pretty sure they have a Pobjoy (or two), too, AA.

    Anon.

    Comment

    • AgCat
      Rank 5 Registered User
      • Aug 2004
      • 416

      #3
      Don't be too impatient!

      Comment

      • avion ancien
        Rank 5 Registered User
        • Aug 2007
        • 5196

        #4
        How patient should I be, AgCat? I waited for a week before initiating this thread. Having had no indication of if and when there might be a reply to my enquiry, I've chosen to pursue a parallel route hopefully to obtain the information that I need.

        Comment

        • paul1867
          Rank 5 Registered User
          • Nov 2012
          • 1431

          #5
          They have had a very busy week with taking and bringing back exhibits at an adjacent three day Steam show over the weekend and putting up the Sea Hurricane for DX show. I was expecting it to be quiet there yesterday but there were several coach loads of visitors having guided tours.
          I had just got round to seeing the glass as half full instead of half empty, when some sod came and drank it......

          Comment

          • avion ancien
            Rank 5 Registered User
            • Aug 2007
            • 5196

            #6
            I have no doubt that the Shuttleworth Collection is very busy at present. And if this is why my request for information remains in the 'waiting' pile, that's quite right and proper. I'm sure that the people there have things to do which justify being given a higher priority. And in saying this, I'm not being in the least bit sarcastic. But the information I seek is necessary for me to pursue a piece of research that I have in hand. That is why I have tried to source it independently and why I've now used this forum to enquire if any of its members can assist me by supplying it. Hopefully future posts here can address that issue?

            Comment

            • paul1867
              Rank 5 Registered User
              • Nov 2012
              • 1431

              #7
              There are SVAC members on the forum and know doubt they are rushing to their filing systems as we speak to find your missive, but there are a lot of waste paper bins to go through.

              I thought I was addressing your problem as to why you may still receive a reply from Shuttleworth.
              I had just got round to seeing the glass as half full instead of half empty, when some sod came and drank it......

              Comment

              • avion ancien
                Rank 5 Registered User
                • Aug 2007
                • 5196

                #8
                Thank you, Paul, but it's not a problem. I only mentioned the fact that I had asked the Shuttleworth Trust because I suspected that otherwise, the responses would have been that I should do so before posting my request on this forum! It's the getting of the information, rather than the source of it, that's important to me.

                Comment

                • Sabrejet
                  Rank 5 Registered User
                  • Mar 2010
                  • 1672

                  #9
                  They definitely have an off-aircraft Blackburne Tomtit, which was there a month or so ago:

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                  Click image for larger version

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                  Hope this is a start!

                  Comment

                  • avion ancien
                    Rank 5 Registered User
                    • Aug 2007
                    • 5196

                    #10
                    Thank you, Sabrejet. Yes, it is a start. But I've my fingers crossed for a finish too - and anything that's in between!

                    Comment

                    • avion ancien
                      Rank 5 Registered User
                      • Aug 2007
                      • 5196

                      #11
                      Today, nearly one month after making my enquiry, I've received a reply to my question from the Shuttleworth Trust. It reads as follows:

                      'It is with regret that I must inform you that it is the current policy of the Shuttleworth Collection not to place such information in the public domain'.

                      One must assume that this policy has been implemented as the Trust perceive that to put such information into the public domain is to inform those who might, armed with it, be minded to steal artefacts from the Collection. If so, I hasten to add that I am not such a person and that whilst I can understand the reasoning behind the policy, to me it suggests that the Shuttleworth Trust has started to tread the path already worn by the Hawkinge museum. This saddens me and inevitably leaves me wondering whether, in due course, visitors to Old Warden will be required to leave their cameras, mobile telephones, notepads and writing implements at the entrance to the site and/or that the Trust will decline to co-operate, either actively or passively, with journalists writing articles or books which concern or mention the artefacts in the Collection?

                      In the meantime, is there anyone planning to visit Old Warden soon who is willing to provide me with details of the engines on display, both attached to and detached from aeroplanes, that are the product of ABC, Blackburne, Douglas, Scott, J.A.Prestwich and British Anzani? I will not ask such person to enquire about any engines in the Collection that are not on display. I require the information for the purposes of an article that I'm writing for the motorcycling press.

                      Comment

                      • Planemike
                        Rank 5 Registered User
                        • Dec 2007
                        • 1780

                        #12
                        Ridiculous, bizarre...........or what ?!!!! Seems a reasonable question ask and expect a factual answer to.

                        Comment

                        • scotavia
                          scotavia
                          • Nov 2005
                          • 2703

                          #13
                          While it has not got the list you desire on line perhaps a member of their organisation migh be of help ?
                          http://www.enginehistory.org/

                          Comment

                          • Mike J
                            Senior Member
                            • Jan 2000
                            • 3241

                            #14
                            I understand that there was a problem at Old Warden a while back with engines and propellers allegedly disappearing. That may well be the reason for this policy.

                            Comment

                            • avion ancien
                              Rank 5 Registered User
                              • Aug 2007
                              • 5196

                              #15
                              Thank you, Scotavia. When first I looked at the AEHS website, I thought that the organisation appeared rather US-centric. But on the basis that if you don't ask, you won't know what the answer will be, I'll contact the AEHS and see if they can help me.

                              Whilst I can understand, Mike J, why your suggestion might be the reason for the policy, what point is there in saying, effectively, to those enquiring from a distance 'we won't tell you anything about the artefacts in our collection' when those less distant - including the criminal fraternity - can turn up at Old Warden, make copious notes and take numerous photographs and then put that into the public domain by using the internet and/or print media - or use that for more nefarious purposes? But then, the Shuttleworth Collection can do what it likes for whatever reason it wishes. It's only accountable to its trustees and the Charity Commission - and certainly not me or the general public.

                              Comment

                              • scotavia
                                scotavia
                                • Nov 2005
                                • 2703

                                #16
                                so true on your second point Avion.As a pro photograher I get annoyed at restrictions on camera use when anyone with illegal intentions can easily conceal cameras of the pinhole kind.

                                Comment

                                • Planemike
                                  Rank 5 Registered User
                                  • Dec 2007
                                  • 1780

                                  #17
                                  Welcome to Project Blriot ‐ The Shuttleworth Collection Online Library and Archive Catalogue

                                  The online catalogue (Blriot) is a major addition to the Archive Research Service. It contains in excess of ten thousand records of books, letters and photographic material; this is the first phase of the project and is concerned with prime sources. This means that folders containing correspondence or photographs are only identified by their titles and a brief description of their contents. Currently these folders are being catalogued in depth but this information will not be available online in the near future. Queries relating to their contents will continue to be processed via the Archive Research Service.

                                  Browsing Blriot is a free service; its purpose is to enable researchers to be aware of the Shuttleworth Collection's rich information assets. It is targeted at:
                                  •Members of the Public with general aviation information enquiries.
                                  •Those with specific technical or historical aviation information inquiries including: ◦Researchers undertaking major projects
                                  ◦Academic researchers
                                  ◦Aviation and Military Museums

                                  •Members of SVAS and Shuttleworth Collection staff
                                  The above is taken from the Trusts own website. As I understood it, one the Trust's prime functions was education. To my mind the way they have dealt with your enquiry hardly fits in with that ethos. AA, you are probably correct in saying the Trust is only accountable to its Trustees but it is reliant on support from the public and it volunteers........

                                  If someone with criminal intent is intent on uplifting a Merlin engine (yes, they do have one!!) I am sure not telling you they have one is hardly going to protect it.

                                  Some years back I enquired about a particular exhibit and received a detailed reply including a number of photographs.
                                  Last edited by Planemike; 13th October 2015, 07:58.

                                  Comment

                                  • avion ancien
                                    Rank 5 Registered User
                                    • Aug 2007
                                    • 5196

                                    #18
                                    Thank you, Planemike. Whilst I agree with your sentiments I see no point in continuing to bang my head against that particular brick wall. Thus I can only hope that someone attending Old Warden, in the near future, will help me to circumnavigate the Shuttleworth Trust online 'nyet'.

                                    Comment

                                    • TwinOtter23
                                      NAM volunteer-Plugmeister
                                      • Jan 2006
                                      • 7681

                                      #19
                                      It might also be worthwhile contacting the Rolls-Royce Heritage Trust.

                                      They compiled a list of Aero-Engines Exhibited & Stored in the UK & Ireland for BAPC; albeit a number of years ago it did feature the engines at Shuttleworth.
                                      Find out what's happening at newarkairmuseum.org
                                      Please help move Chinook ZA717 to Newark Air Museum

                                      Comment

                                      • avion ancien
                                        Rank 5 Registered User
                                        • Aug 2007
                                        • 5196

                                        #20
                                        Thank you, TwinOtter23. I'll certainly pursue that lead. But I have to say that I'm a little surprised that no SVAS members have offered help. But maybe they are not permitted to do so?

                                        Comment

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