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By: 16th March 2015 at 20:50 Permalink - Edited 1st January 1970 at 01:00
-I could swear it used to be hanging up on the wall at IWM Lambeth in the 1960's. Guess I must be mistaken.
By: 16th March 2015 at 21:02 Permalink - Edited 1st January 1970 at 01:00
-The famous Bf110 jet nightfighter.
Very rare.
Moggy
By: 17th March 2015 at 08:53 Permalink - Edited 1st January 1970 at 01:00
-Depending on tha fact that there is 2 rudder from this Aircraft in museums , it is strange this comes up! Please look at WAF Forum there is aperson going in detail on this matter . Conclusion it is FAKE!
best J.
By: 17th March 2015 at 09:54 Permalink - Edited 1st January 1970 at 01:00
-I am convinced the same is hanging in the IWM Lamberth as we speak, minus bullet holes ! I cannot find my photos of my last visit at xmas 14 as i think I did take a couple of it, strange.
By: 17th March 2015 at 12:24 Permalink - Edited 1st January 1970 at 01:00
-Depending on tha fact that there is 2 rudder from this Aircraft in museums , it is strange this comes up! Please look at WAF Forum there is a person going in detail on this matter . Conclusion it is FAKE!best J.
If it is fake then the fakers have correctly positioned the Tail fin part dataplate and the style of tail fin part dataplate itself. Also they have correctly positioned the many small serrated edged circular fabric patches used to cover the holes where the fin is bolted to the horizontal tail plane and the various other fabric patches on the part. Obviously these are missing on the relic itself, but where the paint that once covered these patches has pulled off, the edges are also serrated.... Could you please post a link to the discussion on the other forum you mention? I'm intrigued to find out why this has been determined as being a fake. Are we sure that one of these rudders that resides in the museums you mention is not being auctioned off? Might this be from another aircraft of this pilot? If it is a fake the workmanship is beyond spectacular and that is putting it lightly... ;)
In my opinion at the moment this is not a fake. :)
By: 17th March 2015 at 13:14 Permalink - Edited 1st January 1970 at 01:00
-My shots of the fins from the IWM:
Bf.110 3C+BA tail-fin. by The Guitarsmith, on Flickr
And the Australian War Memorial:
AWM Bf-110 rudder. by The Guitarsmith, on Flickr
By: 17th March 2015 at 13:39 Permalink - Edited 1st January 1970 at 01:00
-So it's clear that the relic up for auction is not one of the fins that survive in the museums. So realistically it can only be from a spare aircraft that Snaufer had on charge whilst Geschwaderkommodore of NJG4. It would not be uncommon for a Geschwaderkommodore and highly respected ace nightfighter pilot to have spare aircraft available to him for use if his usual mount was being serviced etc.
The dates on the auction relic do correlate to Snaufer's known victory list.
By: 17th March 2015 at 14:02 Permalink - Edited 1st January 1970 at 01:00
-This thread seems to explain the provenance
http://www.ww2aircraft.net/forum/archive/index.php?t-38546.html
By: 17th March 2015 at 14:02 Permalink - Edited 1st January 1970 at 01:00
-If it is fake then the fakers have correctly positioned the Tail fin part dataplate and the style of tail fin part dataplate itself. Also they have correctly positioned the many small serrated edged circular fabric patches used to cover the holes where the fin is bolted to the horizontal tail plane and the various other fabric patches on the part. Obviously these are missing on the relic itself, but where the paint that once covered these patches has pulled off, the edges are also serrated.... Could you please post a link to the discussion on the other forum you mention? I'm intrigued to find out why this has been determined as being a fake. Are we sure that one of these rudders that resides in the museums you mention is not being auctioned off? Might this be from another aircraft of this pilot? If it is a fake the workmanship is beyond spectacular and that is putting it lightly... ;)In my opinion at the moment this is not a fake. :)
I dare say its provenance can be proven, so I imagine it is real indeed. But "beyond spectacular" workmanship has fooled many an expert before. Think high-end art and the many times that the art world has been hoodwinked. All we have here is a nicely-patinated piece of aluminium after all; in many cases, art fakers have created catalogue entries and inserted them into the holdings of art libraries to create false provenance. The limits of a faker's art go a long way beyond what is shown here.
As I continue to remind myself, one should never say, 'never'.
By: 17th March 2015 at 14:47 Permalink - Edited 1st January 1970 at 01:00
-Oh I agree, but the effort we are talking about in the art world commands a much more hefty prize than (up to) £20,000. I have a pretty above average experience and knowledge of the structure and minute detailing of the Bf110 and whilst looking at that relic I wholeheartedly stand by my comment and would even commit to upgrading it to "stupendously spectacular workmanship". :)
By: 17th March 2015 at 15:27 Permalink - Edited 1st January 1970 at 01:00
-If that was my bullet riddled tail fin then I'd only be too pleased that it was replaced by the one in the IWM on my aircraft.
By: 17th March 2015 at 15:42 Permalink - Edited 1st January 1970 at 01:00
-That is indeed a very good point too. :)
By: 17th March 2015 at 17:36 Permalink - Edited 1st January 1970 at 01:00
-Tailfin.
http://www.wehrmacht-awards.com/forums/forumdisplay.php?f=116
Here it is! best Jabba
By: 17th March 2015 at 17:59 Permalink - Edited 1st January 1970 at 01:00
-Thanks Jabba. :D
Posts: 765
By: PanzerJohn - 16th March 2015 at 19:44
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2996894/Bullet-ridden-tail-fin-Messerschmitt-flown-world-s-deadliest-fighter-pilot-goes-sale-discovered-used-patch-roof.html