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  • BY767
    Rank 5 Registered User
    • Apr 2004
    • 326

    'Watchdog slams BA's safety'

    'Watchdog slams BA's air safety'

    This story reached the front page of today's Sunday Times.

    http://www.timesonline.co.uk/article...965953,00.html

    Joe
  • philgatwick05
    Senior Member
    • Jun 2005
    • 1621

    #2
    On the face of it, pretty damning

    Comment

    • MINIDOH
      Rank 5 Registered User
      • Jan 2000
      • 711

      #3
      Maybe they should have a look at Ryanairs safety, will make BA's safety look impeccable.

      Comment

      • LBARULES
        Pointless flightaholic!
        • May 2003
        • 9820

        #4
        Can you remember the last story about a case of Ryanair being unsafe? I can't.

        Comment

        • tomfellows
          Rank 5 Registered User
          • Mar 2005
          • 2001

          #5
          AN engine fire on landing a few years ago at Stansted, but that's it. But I suppose every carrier has incidents like that once in their life, so that's hardly unsafe. I think we have to remember as well that BA have a large fleet, so the probability of things going wrong is likely to be higher than that of an airline with a smaller fleet.

          Coming back to Ryanair, just because they used 737-200s, it didn't mean that they were unsafe. In fact, they were probably better maintained than the -800s, because they were older and needed more work done to them perhaps.
          Tom
          My Jetphotos album

          Comment

          • exmpa
            Rank 5 Registered User
            • May 2005
            • 321

            #6
            Maybe they should have a look at Ryanairs safety, will make BA's safety look impeccable.
            I hold no brief whatsoever for Mr O'Leary or the airline he runs, but if you make statements such as the one above you must be prepared to back them up with evidence.

            exmpa

            Comment

            • Mark L
              Rank 5 Registered User
              • Mar 2003
              • 4325

              #7
              Every airline has its fair share of incidents, most are rarely worth commenting on, they just happen. What the AAIB seem to have identified here is a systemic problem within the BA engineering department which means things are not being done that should be done.

              There is always a chance a component will fail within an engine during flight for example, there is nothing anyone can do to prevent that component from failing, and any incident that ocurrs is just down to probability. However when it comes to parts being missed off, insufficient oil quantities etc, then there is clearly a problem which can be adressed within the engineering department.

              The AAIB has identified this within BA due to the high number of preventable incidents due to mechanical failure. Recent Ryanair incidents eg, high bank angles, unstable approaches, incorrect flap settings, fast taxi speeds etc etc (just have a brief look on pprune and you will see what I mean) may well see an investigation by the Irish Aviation authorities into them, but I cant recall hearing about preventable technica failures in the same way as is being talked about here with BA.
              My recent and upcoming flights

              Comment

              • philgatwick05
                Senior Member
                • Jun 2005
                • 1621

                #8
                Ryanair operate the youngest fleet in Europe (if not the world).

                Comment

                • wysiwyg
                  Retard :)
                  • Jan 2000
                  • 3749

                  #9
                  Originally posted by philgatwick05
                  Ryanair operate the youngest fleet in Europe (if not the world).
                  ...flown by anyone mad enough to work for them!

                  Comment

                  • philgatwick05
                    Senior Member
                    • Jun 2005
                    • 1621

                    #10
                    Originally posted by wysiwyg
                    ...flown by anyone mad enough to work for them!

                    Comment

                    • redsquare
                      Member
                      • Dec 2005
                      • 96

                      #11
                      MINIDOH,
                      I have to laugh. As someone who knows a thing or two about Ryanair, I can assure you that that there are no short cuts being taken on maintenance! If Ryanair had the same sort of issues as BA, there would be a never ending backlash and usual tabloid headlines. For whatever reason, BA has been having a lot of technical problems at he moment (running at about 1 emergency per week lately) and some people are in denial.

                      However, BA has a large and varied fleet which is ageing fast except for the Airbuses, this means incidents are more likely anyway but is still not excusable. Scary recent examples including the 3 engine 747 trans-atlantic flight and subsequent fuel emergency and the similar A319 flight where the instruments failed and then the crew continuing the flight is ridiculous. The maintence problems are shocking but they get away with it because of their perceived reputation.

                      One of the few similar Ryanair cases is the engine fire and evacuation in STN which was caused by a faulty batch of engine bearings from CFM which also led to a very similar problem with an Air France A320 shortly afterwords. Ryanair are now pioneers in Boeing's new Maintenance Performance Toolbox which means even greater improvements to procedures. SeeBoeing Press Release for more. Daily maintenance is carried out at night at every base meaning all aircraft are checked by engineers and any recorded problems are rectifyied and are not left 'deferred' like certain other airlines. Heavy hangar maintenance is carried out in-house at Prestwick, Dublin and Stansted including Winglet Mods.

                      If you're going to make slanderous statements about Ryanair MINIDOH, then at least have SOME evidence. Maintenance is taken extremely seriously in Ryanair as it is the only way Ryanair can be defeated as the competition is largely inept. (kidding!)

                      Goodbye.
                      Last edited by redsquare; 3rd January 2006, 01:09.

                      Comment

                      • Dantheman77
                        Rank 5 Registered User
                        • Jul 2004
                        • 763

                        #12
                        to be fair...MOL has quoted that 2 things could ruin Ryanair...1. is an accident caused by poor standards safety or 2. World War3.

                        If you read the book about Ryanair..you will discover that MOL has a mean cost cutting streak to improve profits etc etc...but when it comes down to airplane maitenence then no expense is spared.
                        If you dont play this game with a big heart and a big bag of knuckles in front of the net you dont got dinky doo.......(Mike Myers, Mystery Alaska)

                        Comment

                        • PMN
                          PMN
                          PlaneObsessedBassPlayer
                          • Aug 2005
                          • 5594

                          #13
                          Originally posted by MINIDOH
                          Maybe they should have a look at Ryanairs safety, will make BA's safety look impeccable.

                          One word: Aeroflot.

                          Paul
                          My images on Flickr Jetphotos A.Net

                          Comment

                          • Dantheman77
                            Rank 5 Registered User
                            • Jul 2004
                            • 763

                            #14
                            Originally posted by PMN
                            One word: Aeroflot.

                            Paul

                            oh come on now....be fair....Aeroflot seems to have got a helluva lot better...New Airbus/Boeing planes coming on tap, western style management which includes safety being a high priority. Gone are the days when an Aeroflot captains pre-flight walk-round consisted of nothing more than kicking the tyres....Also im lead to believe the Flight attendants dont come from tractor factories anymore!

                            there are airlines out there with far worse maintenence records than BA. And probably some of them are alot closer to home than you could imagine.
                            Last edited by Dantheman77; 3rd January 2006, 07:27. Reason: Mavis beacon teaches typing training didnt work!
                            If you dont play this game with a big heart and a big bag of knuckles in front of the net you dont got dinky doo.......(Mike Myers, Mystery Alaska)

                            Comment

                            • PMN
                              PMN
                              PlaneObsessedBassPlayer
                              • Aug 2005
                              • 5594

                              #15
                              Originally posted by Dantheman77
                              oh come on now....be fair....Aeroflot seems to have got a helluva lot better...New Airbus/Boeing planes coming on tap, western style management which includes safety being a high priority. Gone are the days when an Aeroflot captains pre-flight walk-round consisted of nothing more than kicking the tyres....Also im lead to believe the Flight attendants dont come from tractor factories anymore!

                              there are airlines out there with far worse maintenence records than BA. And probably some of them are alot closer to home than you could imagine.
                              I was actually joking, but looking back at my post I missed the smiley. Sorry for the confusion!

                              I know they're much better these days, and their captain's don't let their children play with the controls anymore

                              Paul
                              My images on Flickr Jetphotos A.Net

                              Comment

                              • xpboy
                                "The Girls Of Mile High"
                                • Apr 2005
                                • 632

                                #16
                                maybe ill drive to london from ncl lol
                                You'll Find My Snaps@
                                http://www.jetphotos.net/showphotos.php?userid=27034

                                http://www.airliners.net/search/photo.search?pid=35788

                                Comment

                                • wozza
                                  Chelsea Fan
                                  • Sep 2005
                                  • 1089

                                  #17
                                  Well is there actually any maintenance issues. I do not see there to be 'Poor Safety' if aircraft keeping breaking due to old age

                                  Comment

                                  • philgatwick05
                                    Senior Member
                                    • Jun 2005
                                    • 1621

                                    #18
                                    Originally posted by redsquare
                                    One of the few similar Ryanair cases is the engine fire and evacuation in STN which was caused by a faulty batch of engine bearings from CFM which also led to a very similar problem with an Air France A320 shortly afterwords. Ryanair are now pioneers in Boeing's new Maintenance Performance Toolbox which means even greater improvements to procedures. SeeBoeing Press Release for more. Daily maintenance is carried out at night at every base meaning all aircraft are checked by engineers and any recorded problems are rectifyied and are not left 'deferred' like certain other airlines. Heavy hangar maintenance is carried out in-house at Prestwick, Dublin and Stansted including Winglet Mods.
                                    Thanks for this - a well presented and coherent article backed up by facts. Are Ryanair retrofitting winglets to the existing 737-800 fleet?

                                    Comment

                                    • redsquare
                                      Member
                                      • Dec 2005
                                      • 96

                                      #19
                                      Are Ryanair retrofitting winglets to the existing 737-800 fleet?
                                      Yep, only 2 so far (EI-DCK) with the winglets being fitted at approx 1 aircraft per week during their maintenance C-Checks at Prestwick. This rate could change depending on fleet schedules i.e. if time permits. All new aircraft deliveries will be fitted in Seattle from later this month meaning there are 90 conversions to be done.

                                      Comment

                                      • paulc
                                        Rank 5 Registered User
                                        • Feb 2003
                                        • 1072

                                        #20
                                        There is a saying that goes "if you think safety is expensive then try having an accident" and it is very true. Any accident will have a negative effect on an airlines business but most accidents are a series of small events which in isolation would not be a problem but taken together can lead to an accident. The AA DC10 at ORD in 1979 is a classic case - the loss of an engine on take off should not have been a problem but the fact that when then engine fell off it took hydraulic lines with it which caused the slats to retract and stall warning systen to fail, was a problem.
                                        http:www.jetphotos.net/showphotos.php?userid=481

                                        Comment

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