MH17 Report is out and is being thrashed about under Military Aviation

Read the forum code of contact

Member for

15 years 9 months

Posts: 1,684

MH17 Report is out and is being thrashed about under Military Aviation in this Forum.

For those who still wish this also under a Commercial Aviation tragedy here is the URL -

http://www.onderzoeksraad.nl/

There is a lot of stuff there to digest and it is in English as well.

Hope those posting do not get this thread closed by moderators as well.

Original post

Member for

16 years 6 months

Posts: 1,348

There is a lot of good stuff on the Safety Board website to download, and it will take a while to digest. I have spent much of the day reading this and watching the earlier Almaz-Antey press conference, and am far from having digested it all.

But I fail to see a reason for the other thread being closed. This is not the first time I have spent several hours gathering information in order to make what might have been a useful contribution to a thread that was running with a high signal-to-noise ratio, only to find that it had been locked down = I had wasted my time.

Member for

18 years 4 months

Posts: 2,318

This is not the first time I have spent several hours gathering information in order to make what might have been a useful contribution to a thread that was running with a high signal-to-noise ratio, only to find that it had been locked down = I had wasted my time.

Don't let the info go to waste.

http://www.pprune.org/rumours-news/565993-mh17-update.html

Metabunk also have a few threads running with detailed analysis

https://www.metabunk.org/almaz-anteys-live-buk-explosion-tests.t6903/

https://www.metabunk.org/flight-mh17.f46/

https://www.metabunk.org/

Member for

12 years 3 months

Posts: 5,905

There is a lot of good stuff on the Safety Board website to download, and it will take a while to digest. I have spent much of the day reading this and watching the earlier Almaz-Antey press conference, and am far from having digested it all.

+1

It will take time to digest.

Member for

11 years 11 months

Posts: 101

Fascinating how many people have forgotten the bragging Facebook post with video of falling plane pieces by the local Ukranian rebels themselves claiming to have shoot it down.

The Facebook posting was taken down within hours and the Russians disinformation department swung into gear with a concocted story that a Ukranian fighter shoot it down.

Why does Russia always act so innocently ?.

Member for

15 years 9 months

Posts: 1,684

No one in their sane mind forgets what maniacs brag about after committing atrocities. It's bringing them to justice that is paramount for the good of the peaceful world and all those who lost their lives and those bereaved.

Member for

12 years 3 months

Posts: 5,905

Can someone direct me to the report annex dealing with the cause of death of the passengers. I understand that there is an annex dedicated to this but can't found trace of the document on the Dutch safety Board website.

EDIT:
Found the relevant part in annex doc (A to U). But I had the impression that we would see an abridged detail of the legal autopsies.
The dedicated part of the report is rather weak in term of what has happened to the passengers. I have found only generalization (except for the two pilots + the attendant in the cockpit).
There are also some contradiction and this report bear some traces of redacting (slight inconsistencies b/w the intends and the results despite the extensive work done and differences in vocabulary from technical to what seems non technical insertion. I was rather disappointed seeing that even after factoring in the necessary care and candor that such public report have to bear.

(See my take below)

Member for

12 years 3 months

Posts: 5,905

What I didn't like reading regarding the passenger's horrible fate:

- Nothing was done to explain why this flight was being targeted despite the 150 different crossing of this zone the same day on the same route. Despite the slight flight deviation, the second radar echo, the second flight nearby*, the NATO AWAC data**, nothing is done to explain if there are any links. And the rebel didn't seem to have randomly targeted a plane.

- The long explanation for the lack of consciousness of the passengers. The frigid outside temperature is recursively put forward when static temperature (-50C) and arrested temperature (-15C)are two different things. The report even detailing minutiously how the fuselage broke apart with the cockpit section cut out and falling apart, the first class section torned out with the top fuselage bending upward and the floor (with passengers) falling away downward; the center section was then exposed to the rushing airstream with passengers obviously having their seat belt untightened (cruise leg and flight deviation to avoid weather generated turbulences); the rear fuselage then broke out in a peeling fashion with the aft section separating in once before breaking apart. How could the passenger have freezed to death in such a scenario? Those in the first class mostly might have been ejected and, perhaps, submitted to the extreme cold before entering warmer layer of air, those in the rear cabin might have been flushed by the violent airstream on the rear bulkhead.

Frankly I do not understand why they didn't disclose more of their results, even in an edited fashion. This is a technical report. Facts are what bears some importance. And sadly, the despicable idea that passengers dies peacefully in a sudden flash of heat and lights stands firm. Again.

To conclude, I would like to insist that the report constitutes an impressive sum of work written in pedagogical terms, accessible to many with a noble intention to tackle all the interrogation of this tragedy, from the small details to the organic cause leading to the disaster (no piping down of Intel***). A the ages of blatant propaganda from Russia and the sinister French Prosecutors devoid of any sensibility**** this stands out of the ordinary.

An oustanding read.

*there are no transcript[of interview of the pilots of the nearby flight
** Reported as non-disclosed and bearing no informational content - if someone had tailed MH17, this would be apparent on the radar and converge with the MH17 deviation triggering some interest by the air defense.
***But as bloggers on an aviation forun that were discussing those shotdown after the 14th july, we can't stand otherwise that being outraged by this.
****to say the least