Pics from 1952 - where to post?

[Ray Jade]

Caption "Shoreham 2nd August 1952".

Once owned by Airspeed test pilots George Errington and Ron Clear amongst many others.

Second shot is at Old Warden on 27th June 2004.

By pure flook, Air Britain Archive has just landed on my doormat. Front cover G-ACTF. Article suggests that the aircraft was owned by Ron Clear in 1952. Is he perhaps in the photo?

[Arm Waver]

Ray Jade
A small bit of information for you about one of your pictures:
Posting 101 - DH.82a Tiger Moth T7145
Con No. 83584
Became G-APFT 27 August 1957
Sold as PH-NIK 22 November 1957
Fate unknown.
On checking Stuart Mckay's Tiger Moth book it would appear she no longer exists as of 1999.

Hope of some help
OAW

[SteveYoung]

Ray / ArmWaver, I've just had a look at the aircraft in post #111 again, and in all honesty I don't actually think it's a Miles type.

AW, I can see where you're coming from regarding the shape of the windscreen, but I think that's really just the way the light is reflected off it. A Miles windscreen would have a greater area forward of the rear frame than this image seems to have. If this aeroplane were to be a Miles Falcon (for example), the bottom edge of the windscreen would only be a few inches forward of a line running from the bottom of both sides of the canopy framing, which I don't think is correct; from looking at Hairyplane's Falcon a few years back I seem to recall the forward bottom edge of the windscreen being further forward than that.

So what could it be? Looking at the position of the side window in relation to the screen, the relative size and height of the portion of windscreen visible, and the positioning of the cheat line along the side, I've got a feeling that your mystery aircraft might be one of the Percival types (Proctor?) as shown in post #108...

Another potential avenue to explore, or have I just muddied the waters unnecessarily?

Steve

[Arm Waver]

Steve,
After looking at the Miles Tribute website I stand by the idea of it being a Miles M.17 Monarch...
The windscreen depth doesn't appear to be as deep on this type as other Miles slanted ones.
Hairyplanes Falcon is a larger machine and has a different genesis so although similar would be quite different...
Have a nose at this and see what you think...
I'm enjoying this challenge.

The miles site is at:
http://www.miles-aircraft.com/
The Monarch page:
http://www.miles-aircraft.com/M.17_monarch.html

ATB
OAW

[Ray Jade]

Caption "Gemini JWG Shoreham 2nd August 1952"

Though I might resume this old topic...

According to (the defunct??) Miles site (http://www.milesaircraft.org/aircraft/m65/m65afhis.html) this aircraft was s/n 6292. Known History: The CoA was issued on 20 August 1947 as G-AJWG. The CoA expired in March 1965, and it was scrapped at Sleap.

AJ Jackson took four pictures (http://www.ajjcollection.co.uk/m6.htm).

[Ray Jade]

Belated thanks for this.

According to http://www.dehavilland.ukf.net/_DH%2...odn%20list.txt, she crashed whilst on the Dutch register and was presumably written-off.

Ray Jade
A small bit of information for you about one of your pictures:
Posting 101 - DH.82a Tiger Moth T7145
Con No. 83584
Became G-APFT 27 August 1957
Sold as PH-NIK 22 November 1957
Fate unknown.
On checking Stuart Mckay's Tiger Moth book it would appear she no longer exists as of 1999.

Hope of some help
OAW

[Ray Jade]

Caption “Wicko FJB Shoreham 2nd August 1952”

An easy one to document, this, since the aircraft still exists and has its own website: http://www.wicko.com/. Includes blow-by-blow photos of the aircraft being dragged back in to flying condition.

Built at Eastleigh with s/n 5 and registered on 1-Nov-38. Sold to Midland Aero Club, then served with various units in WW2 as DR613. Owned by Wikner again from 1946, thence it passed to a number of owners before becoming derelict at Baginton. From 1998, it has been owned by Joe Dible and under restoration by Ron Souch.

It is likely that the aircraft was owed by Philippa and Lettice Curtis at the time this photo was taken; they frequently raced it with the number 39.

Anyone care to id some of the other aircraft in the background?

[Auster Fan]

Glider

Caption "Glider (+Thompson), Christchurch". Probably 1952.

I don't pretend to identify the type (Slingsby...?) but it seems to have a roundel and (illegible) code. Any guesses?

The glider looks like a Sedbergh to me (aka "The Barge" in ATC parlance). Great pictures for me, being such a "young chap". I can only dream about seeing Tiger Moths et al at Summer camps!

[Ray Jade]

The next in an increasingly irregular series...

Caption “Argus IYO Shoreham 2nd August 1952”

According to G-INFO, a Fairchild 24W-41A serial number 850. No longer on the register.

Only a few hits on the web for this. It was owned or operated by a Walter Bowles in 1947 (http://www.beney.org.uk/personal/miles/wpb2.php but the captioned picture doesn’t display) who handed it to the Women's Junior Air Corp. The RAF history pages mention the aircraft at http://www.raf.mod.uk/history/dianabw4.html in an article about the ATA pilot Diana Barnato-Walker:

“The W.J.A.C had their own aircraft, named "Grey Dove" it was a Fairchild, in which girls could fly for 7/6d. On some weekends over a 100 girls could fly depending on weather conditions.

The W.J.A.C Fairchild (G-AIYO) was due to be christened by HRH Princess Marina Duchess of Kent on the 17th July 1948, and was to be done in a unique ceremony, by pouring champagne over the engine housing! Diana arrived at White Waltham on the 11th July to collect the aircraft and enable her flying time to become familiar with it. She was climbing out of White Waltham on a test flight, having reached about 400 feet, when suddenly the aircraft burst into flames. Switching off the fuel Diana could have easily been in a fatal situation if the aircraft stalled, but where was there to land? She broke all rules that she had had drummed into her by instructors and experience over the years, and turned back to the airfield, ending the emergency by landing the aircraft diagonally across White Waltham airfield. The fire crew questioned Diana as to why she was starting to give them trouble after the war, being that she had a clean slate throughout it in far more dangerous circumstances! The aircraft was burnt and melted on the portside fuselage but in the three days that led up to its christening the damage was rectified to the best of the abilities of the ground crew and the ceremony took place as scheduled.”

Six photos of G-AIYO are listed in the AJ Jackson Collection (http://www.ajjcollection.co.uk/aiaa.htm).

ps what is the maximum attachment size now? It sure seems to be above 100kB.

[Ray Jade]

An alternative view of the aircraft from posts 1 & 81 et al.

Caption "Meteor 8 WK647 Hullavington July 1952 54 Squadron (orange & blue squares)"

Taken at Hullavington ATC cadet camp (hence the pose of the chap left of the Meteor?)

Aircraft the the distance seem to me to be Wellingtons. Much better shot coming (No 82).

[Papa Lima]

300 kb max size nowadays.
Sure look like Wellingtons! I guess they would have been Mk XIX.

[682al]

Sure look like Wellingtons! I guess they would have been Mk XIX.

I think you mean T10 Papa Lima, surely the only Mark left in service in 1952?

[Papa Lima]

Yes, Mk X, I looked too hastily in the Putnams Vickers and only saw that the last model was the Mk XIX.
I should have remembered - even while I was in the RAF we saw Mk Xs I think at Lindholme for navigation training - shows how old I am! "Old men forget"

[Ray Jade]

Wait for number 82...

[Ray Jade]

Caption “Messanger KKG Shoreham 2nd August 1952”; first seen 28th June 1952 at Christchurch.

G-INFO and others have this as c/n 6700. http://daveg4otu.tripod.com/airfields/xchres.html records it as based at Christchurch to 1960 and from 1961. http://pascal.brugier.free.fr/registre/txt/hb-aaa.txt and http://members.aol.com/warwicaero/mi...38twoafhis.htm have it on the Swiss register as HB-EEC at some point. The latter notes it as crashed in the UK in 1968.

AJ Jackson squeezed off four shots of it (http://www.ajjcollection.co.uk/m6.htm)

[mike currill]

Caption "Shoreham 2nd August 1952".

Once owned by Airspeed test pilots George Errington and Ron Clear amongst many others.

Second shot is at Old Warden on 27th June 2004.

By pure flook, Air Britain Archive has just landed on my doormat. Front cover G-ACTF. Article suggests that the aircraft was owned by Ron Clear in 1952. Is he perhaps in the photo?

Those Pobjoy geared radials always amused me, I heard a rumour that tappet clearances were set using a screw driver tip as the feeler guage.

[Ray Jade]

Caption “Moth Minor Coupe Shoreham 2nd August 1952”

G-INFO has this as c/n 9407, first registered 27-Jul-39. Its CoA expired 27-Aug-69 and owner named as RM Long of Romford.

During its life, it was registered as E-1(G) and E-0236(G) according to http://pascal.brugier.free.fr/registre/txt/g-aaaa.txt; I presume Spanish but why the “(G)”’s? AJ Jackson only got three in of this one http://www.ajjcollection.co.uk/d9.htm).

It is pictured at Gatwick’s Beehive Terminal in 1956 at http://www.gatwickaviationsociety.or...ott+Collection and otherwise listed at the DH Museum at London Colney (http://www.dehavillandmuseum.co.uk/aircraft.html). It’s not clear what its condition is, but it seems to be on display (must go there) – Bruce?

[Ray Jade]

Caption “Proctor HZY Shoreham 2nd August 1952”

A Procter 5 c/n AE84 according to G-INFO. According to http://pascal.brugier.free.fr/registre/txt/oo-aaa.txt, it spent time on the Belgian register as OO-ARM and is apparently still in existence at the Royal Army and Military History Museum in Brussels, although I couldn’t find any pics on the web - can anyone post any?

AJ Jackson pictured the aircraft 5 times http://www.ajjcollection.co.uk/ahaa.htm.

[Arm Waver]

Caption “Moth Minor Coupe Shoreham 2nd August 1952”

G-INFO has this as c/n 9407, first registered 27-Jul-39. Its CoA expired 27-Aug-69 and owner named as RM Long of Romford.

During its life, it was registered as E-1(G) and E-0236(G) according to http://pascal.brugier.free.fr/registre/txt/g-aaaa.txt; I presume Spanish but why the “(G)”’s? AJ Jackson only got three in of this one http://www.ajjcollection.co.uk/d9.htm).

It is pictured at Gatwick’s Beehive Terminal in 1956 at http://www.gatwickaviationsociety.or...ott+Collection and otherwise listed at the DH Museum at London Colney (http://www.dehavillandmuseum.co.uk/aircraft.html). It’s not clear what its condition is, but it seems to be on display (must go there) – Bruce?

The E mark is not Spanish. It is UK early B class registration i.e. "Trade Plates".
E was DH, U was Miles..
These days it is G-nn-nnn where the first two n (for number) is the constructor/modification agency.

[Ray Jade]

Of course! I'd forgotten

[Ray Jade]

Captioned “Constellation VT-DEO London 29th August 1952 (Comet LYS behind port wheel)”

Surprisingly little information on this machine. One of four newly built aircraft to join Air India from 1949, VT-DEO was named ‘Bengal Princess’ according to http://www.airwhiners.net/whine_cheez/20040726.htm. The same source notes that the survivors (VT-DEP was destroyed by a sabotage supposedly by the KMT and CIA) were sold to Aeronaves de Mexico after January 1958.

Anybody know what its registration in Mexico was and what became of it?

AJ Jackson pictured it with Air India (http://www.ajjcollection.co.uk/l1.htm)

Since it was captioned... DH106 Comet 1 s/n 6005 G-ALYS served with BOAC until withdrawn in 1954. It was the first jet airliner with a CoA as such. It was reported being dismantled at Farnborough at the time of the 1957 SBAC show http://www.scramble.nl/mil/show/show...s/farnbo57.htm.

[Ray Jade]

No caption.

By comparison with 77 (VT-DEO) this photo was taken on 29th August 1952 at London Heathrow. My father did not note any ‘first seen’ Viscounts that day, but in the middle of a selection of numbers for the 29th at Heathrow is G-ALWE, Hurn 28th August 1952 which may mean that he saw this aircraft again next day (or maybe something else reminded him?)

It is not a 600 series prototype from the fuselage length and number of windows. In any case, the first prototype was in bits in Kartoum having suffered a collapsed undercarridge on the 27th.

It might be either 700 series G-AMAV (see http://forum.keypublishing.co.uk/sho...9&postcount=19) or 701 series G-ALWE or G-ALWF. The latter were built in 1952 but I can’t determine when or if the might have been in BEA colours at Heathrow in late August 1952.

[Ray Jade]

No caption

Clearly at Hurn, possibly August 1952.

Sadly, the picture is too blurred for a serial number (or indeed anything very identifying).

Anyone care to identify the mark and guess the unit?

[Bruce]

It 'looks' like a T3

[Ray Jade]

A few poor ones and a few good ones left.

80 DH89A Domine (Dragon Rapide) G-AIDL

No caption. Hurn, on or after 9th April 1952.

Possibly one of the least good photos ever published of “The Wander”, Googling on this aircraft’s registration gives well over 100 good hits.

C/n 6968 built 1946 and registered as TX310 but immediately declared surplus, it was brought by Allied Airways Ltd (as G-AIDL) and used as the personal aircraft of Eric Gandar Dower. By the early 1950’s, it was owned by Goodhew Aviation Limited. Did they operate it in 1952?

After a very long service history (most of which is here: http://www.cct.u-net.com/c:%5CHACHom...H89G-AIDL.html) , its now operated by Air Atlantique and frequently seen out and about.

81 Airspeed Consul

No caption. Any body recognize the livery?

Anybody identify the aircraft in the background (which are sharper than the consul...)?

[Ray Jade]

Caption "Wellington NA916 Hullavington July 1952"

No hits on the web for this aircraft, not even AJ Jackson.

Previously on this thread, folks have guessed at Mk X and 201AFS. Is there enough to confirm that here?

My father recalls that he was due to fly in these aircraft (ATC Cadet Camp) but they were grounded due to a recent fatal accident. Anyone know anyhing about the circumstances?

[Ray Jade]

Caption "Javelin WD808 Farnborough 7th Spetember 1952"

After the John Derry crash, the weather on 7th must have seemed suitably gloomy.

WD808 flew for the first time in August 1952 and put on an impressive performance at the SBAC show (the Pathe archive has some good flying footage). It was destroyed in June 1953 after encontering superstall, killing Peter Lawrence.

Better pics and write-up at http://www.btinternet.com/~javelin/p...evelopment.htm

Aircraft in background? Ganet

[Ray Jade]

No caption. Farnborough 7th September 1952

G-ALBO was the Britannia prototype, which first flew 16th August 1952.

It was used for the bulk of the Britannia test programme, especially after the loss of the second prototype. It was used for trials of the Bristol Orion turboprop (http://www.transportarchive.org.uk/g...mtv=G1&pnum=13) and thus the Britannia 400 twin deck airliner.

AJ Jackson took 21 shots of this aircraft including air-to-air (http://www.ajjcollection.co.uk/alaa.htm)

The RAF Museum apparently has one or more engines preserved (http://www.mda.org.uk/aircraft/3341.htm)

[adrian_gray]

Anybody identify the aircraft in the background (which are sharper than the consul...)?

Hmmm. Reminds me of a Hastings, but I'm not sure that they sit high enough. Anyone got a piccy of a Tudor to hand? That's got to be a good bet.

Adrian

[Ray Jade]

No caption; Farnborough 7th September 1952

Another fairly poor picture, I’m afraid. G-ALBN was the first prototype of the Bristol 173, which eventually lead to the Bristol 192 Belvedere. It also carried the military serial XF785 at various times including carrier trials on HMS Eagle in 1953. It took the maintenance serial 7648M and was deep stored in Cosford. http://www.filton.flyer.co.uk/bristol/prod173.html.

Since 2002, it has been at Kemble.

Plenty of good piccies at http://www.transportarchive.org.uk/t...mtv=G1&pnum=1; AJ Jackson fired off just one http://www.ajjcollection.co.uk/b17.htm .