South- Americian Airforces.

[glitter]

Originally posted by Castor
Mirage 2000Br
Pro: A proven great fighter.
Con: Expensive, in the end of it's lifecycle.

Wrong.
Very expensive to buy but much cheaper than the Sukhoi to use so that during the whole lifecycle, both are pretty close.

Originally posted by A-29
The french AF operates a few 2000-5 (around 37) is scheduled to retire from service in a near future to be replaced by Rafale.

Near future ?
the mirage 2000-5 should last until 2020 and will have at leat a last major upgrade in the 2012 timeframe.

[par Benelos]

http://www.mirage2000br.com.br
they do whole websites for the exports now

[m.ileduets]

So does Saab:
here

[par Benelos]

do you have one for sukhoi ?

[m.ileduets]

Not yet, but I found an interesting interview with the Gripen CEO. The claim that Gripen flight hours would be ten times less expensive than the Sukhoi's sounds almost too good to be true :


"Flying Sukhoi is far too expensive"


CEO of the Anglo Swedish fighter jet criticizes the Russian aircraft, attacks Mirage of the consortium Embraer/Dassault e guarantees the transfer of technology if they win FAB's bidding of US$ 1 billion.


Joaquim Castanheira e Marco Damiani



CEO of Gripen International, Ian McNamee, landed on Wednesday, Jan. 14th, with the purpose of conducting two strategic discussions. He met with the Swedish and British Ambassadors to discuss one specific item: how to increase the chances of Gripen, manufactured by the Anglo-Swedish consortium SAAB-BAE SYSTEMS, in the bidding US$ 1 billion promoted by FAB. Nothing is easy. Fighter jet of latest generation, the Gripen competes with the Mirage F-5/BR, manufactured in partnership with the Brazilian Embraer and the French Dassault - and in this competition (Gripen) faces a strong adversary called nationalism. Besides that, Gripen also faces the Russian Sokhoi that has the biggest flying range in the world among all fighter jets.

The Brazilian selection could be made before the end of this first semester. FAB has already issued a confidential document on the competitors and President Luiz Inácio Lula da Silva created a working group to study the document. As soon as this group is formed, its members will have 60 days to conclude their work and, finally, the National Defense Council is to appoint the name of the fighter jet to be acquired, -- initially 12 units. The pressure over the bidding process drags on for about 3 years and grows bigger as it approaches the final decision. On the Gripen side, as this was made clear to Dinheiro, McNamee exerts his pressure. "To be nationalist is to choose what is best for the country", he sad. "Mirage is an old aircraft and Sukhoi has a very high operational cost". These are his rationale:

Dinheiro: Why Gripen?
Ian McNamee: The main requirement received from the Brazilian Air Force is that they want a multi-role aircraft. The aircraft should be able to attack an enemy, defend the territory and exert surveillance of borders. Our aircraft meets all these requirements - with advantages over the competitors.

Dinheiro: Some people say that your aircraft is unsuitable to the continental sizes of Brazil, because of its short-range.
McNamee: Gripen's range is very similar to Mirage and F-16. I accept that in relation to Sukhoi, the range of our aircraft is shorter. However, Sukhoi is 3 times bigger than all competitors and needs 3 times more fuel to operate. Another criticism that I have seen is that Gripen cannot be refueled during flight. Untrue. Our fighter jet carries a complete system of refueling during flight.

Dinheiro: Is there an economic advantage of Gripen over its competitors?
McNamee: Cost of hour/flight of Gripen is extremely low. I could mention, as a reference, that Gripen costs about US$ 2,300, while this cost goes up to about US $ 8,000 for the F-16 and US $ 25,000 to Sukhoi. This means, to fly a Gripen is 10 times less expensive than a Sukhoi.

Dinheiro: Gripen is praised by its avionics. Please comment on its radars and other equipments.
McNamee: Everything is of latest generation. Everything is digital. The aircraft can be operated with precision in accordance with each operation. Compared with other aircrafts, our radars have more range than any other. The Swedish government delivered to the Brazilian government documents of performance of these radars and its capabilities. In comparison with the Mirage, our radar is 5 times more powerful.

Dinheiro: Mirage is the choice. Is this why the aircraft is on your line of fire?
McNamee: I don't know. I read several articles about the bidding, talk to various persons and in some instances I hear people talking about Mirage. Sometimes I hear a lot about Sukhoi. I guess Mirage could be our main competitor, because of Embraer, a world class leading company.

Dinheiro: Embraer claims that only Dassault, the manufacturer of Mirage, is going to transfer technology do Brazil.
McNamee: This is not true

Dinheiro: Are you willing to transfer technology.
McNamee: I want to emphasize that I don't know exactly what kind of technology transfer Embraer is talking about. Is it new technology. Is it old? I have no idea. We are prepared to transfer the technology of the most advanced software used in the aircraft. Our proposal to the Brazilian government gives all details about everything we would like to transfer. What we are going to transfer should allow the Brazilians to control the weapon systems that they are going to use.

Dinheiro: With Gripen, is Brazil able to open source-codes and therefore be able to control software?
McNamee: Yes. It is part of our proposal the transfer of technology which also includes the creation here in Brazil of a Gripen Development Center.

Dinheiro: Gripen engine is made in the United States - and the Americans do not transfer technology. Isn't this an insuperably limitation?
McNamee: We use a basic General Electric engine that is modified and developed by Volvo in Sweden. There is no embargo over these engines. GE is present in Brazil and is able to provide technical assistance.

Dinheiro: What about the weapons? Gripen uses American weapons.
McNamee: In our proposal, we offered a wide range of non-US weapons. They include weapons made in Israel, Sweden, South Africa and, even, French weapons. They are all part of the Gripen weapon system. Our aircraft can carry them, recognize them and works with them without any problem.

Dinheiro: Gripen is considered a small aircraft. Isn't this a problem?
McNamee: One thing people seem to forget is that Gripen was designed to operate in areas without any infrastructure. Gripen can land in roads and remote areas. Its complete refueling on the ground takes about 15 minutes. Gripen is an aircraft that does not need air bases and major infrastructure. It was developed to undertake operations with maximum efficiency.

Dinheiro: Embraer claims that they have reached the highest stages of its subsonic capabilities. Is Gripen willing to teach Embraer to fly above the sound speed?
McNamee: If we have a long term relationship with Brazil and if Embraer becomes our partner - especially if we are talking about the acquisition of up to 100 aircrafts -- , we would have no problem in showing Embraer how to develop supersonic technology within the company and give support so that they could support Gripen in Brazil.

Dinheiro: Have you had contacts with Embraer?
McNamee: No, but if we are selected, we are open to discussions provided we have the agreement of the Brazilian government. So far, Embraer has not asked us anything. When are have tried a contact through SAAB, the company chaired by Mr. Maurício Botelho told they were not available at this point in time.

Dinheiro: What else is Gripen offering?
McNamee: our aircraft is on its early stages of life. First delivery of such aircraft started now, some 4 months ago. What we are offering Brazil is an export version of an aircraft that is likely to be in operation for the next 30, 40 years, and to be used by several countries. I don't believe Mirage will stay in operation for the next 30, 40 years. Mirage does not simply have a path for upgrades. I would like to say that Mirage is not a bad aircraft. I just think that is it an old aircraft. It is an aircraft of an old generation.

Dinheiro: In the purchase we see a major emphasis on the offset proposal that is being offered by the competitors. How is your proposal in relation to the offset?
McNamee: What I can say is that we offered an offset that is at least the same amount of the bidding. It consists of an offset directly related to the aircraft. It is related to the willingness of Swedish and British companies to invest in Brazil. With both the experience of BAE Systems and SAAB, we have about 40 years of experience in offset programs. We never failed to comply with our obligations related to offset. We spent some 4 years investing in Brazil working with different companies through the offset principle. We should be able to do a fantastic work. We feel absolutely normal that governments seek offset in a purchase of such nature.

Dinheiro: This bidding is dragging for about 3 years. Isn't this a stressing situation?
McNamee: Yes. Everything related to the process is stressing. Decisions involving a selection such as this are very complex. And there is no easy decision. We operate in various parts of the world and in all countries we live this difficult situations.

Dinheiro: There is in the government a strong sense of nationalism. Is it possible that the bidding is already decided in favor of Embraer?
McNamee: There is always such possibility. But nationalism does not mean you are going to choose something old and call it a national champion. Nationalism, in my view, is to chose what guarantees the future. We made an excellent offer to the Brazilian government. FAB has studied our aircraft thoroughly, in detail and with great expertise. I am convinced that the evaluation was a correct one and technically very competent.

Dinheiro: What is your view on the quality of the work done?
McNamee: FAB personnel that we have had contact are among the best we know around the world. They never believed in what we say until they check the facts by themselves during tests of the aircraft to be sure everything was true. Brazil sent to Sweden 3 outstanding pilots. They underwent tests to the limits of the aircraft.

Dinheiro: It is estimated that a fighter jet, without the weapons, could cost about US$ 30 million. Is it correct?
McNamee: Yes, depending on the configuration, this is a quite reasonable figure.

Dinheiro: What is the Gripen business performance?
McNamee: In July we offered Gripen to the Czech Republic and before Christmas we were selected to supply 14 aircrafts. To South Africa we sold 28. In the world, we placed 54 aircrafts in the last 4 years

Dinheiro: If you are selected, how long do you need to deliver the aircrafts?
McNamee: We need 36 months to deliver the first and more 12 months to deliver to complete the supply of the 12 fighter jets.





link

[A-29]

m.ileduets,

I read the interview, he is trying to sell it, that's it. In thelast months there were many visits by members of the Swedish government in an intent to lobby the aircraft, the same were made by Russians and the French.
It is too much speculation, but, according to specialized press, as I mentioned before, it will be between the Gripen and Flanker.

Regards,

[A-29]

Adelphi,

Tks for the info, sounds interesting.

Regards,

[A-29]

par Benelos/glitter

The delivery of the Rafale to the French AF has been postponed?
I guess that's the reason to keep and upgrade the M2000C and M2000-5 for more years than expected (I know that the D and N versions will remain in service for more years than the Air Defense version).
Its a good and combat proven aircraft, but, it cannot matches the Flanker and Gripen and also, as I mentioned before, the aircraft that will be choose as the new FAB Fx will replace also the upgraded F-EM/F-5FM starting in 2020.
In this case the gripen has an advantage over the others despite the fact that, personnaly, I prefer the Flanker.

Regards,

[m.ileduets]

But of course! After all he's the Gripen CEO. He would be mad, if he wasn't trying to sell it.

But there's certainly some truth in what he's claiming (what makes the Su-35 a little less attractive are certainly the running costs, no doubt). It's just a question how much he's leaving out. For example he doesn't mention Mirage flight hour costs, just F-16 and Su-35. This probably means that the price difference is marginal. There are other passages in which he's clearly beating around the bush, like when the interviewer adresses the range issue.

I'm suprised to hear from you that it will be between Gripen and Su-35. From what I've read ,I got the impression that the Mirage was in the lead due to the Dassault- Embraer alliance.

[the_baphomet_00]

Originally posted by A-29
what the status of the Venezuelan F-16s fleet? Do you know if your government will send them to participate in Cruzex here in Brazil at the end of this year? It will be great to see them here.

Hi A-29..!!!

The venezuelan air force F-16´s fleet is conformed by 21 machines: 17 single seaters and 4 twin seaters..

They are well maintained and have a very good level of readiness...

Currently, the VAF is in the first phase of the adquiring process for some Python 4 missiles.. currently, there is signed a pre-contract or something like this for that...

Also, the F-16 fleet will be overhauled by SABCA.. then, will be integrated some new armaments and avionics like the Python said before..

About the CRUZEX2004 exercise, I hope that our air force will send four F-16s or Mirage 50s... but it finally will depend of the political situation here in my country... all about Chavez you know...

[A-29]

m.ileduets,


The fact is that the FX has been delayed so many times and the companies had plenty of time to improve their proposals. If the FX had its decision in the planned year which was 2002, no doubt that the Mirage 2000-5 would be the winner. But, the ones for the Flanker and Gripen are more attractive than for the M2000. Also, the pilots prefer the Gripen and the Flanker and this you have to take in consideration.

No matter who will be the winner, I'm sure that Embraer will be involved in the project.

Regards,

[glitter]

Originally posted by m.ileduets

Dinheiro: Is there an economic advantage of Gripen over its competitors?
McNamee: Cost of hour/flight of Gripen is extremely low. I could mention, as a reference, that Gripen costs about US$ 2,300, while this cost goes up to about US $ 8,000 for the F-16 and US $ 25,000 to Sukhoi. This means, to fly a Gripen is 10 times less expensive than a Sukhoi.

$8,000 for a F-16 ? the block 60 I suppose ?
But, why didn't tell us how much for the mirage ??

Originally posted by m.ileduets

Dinheiro: Gripen is praised by its avionics. Please comment on its radars and other equipments.
McNamee: Everything is of latest generation. Everything is digital. The aircraft can be operated with precision in accordance with each operation. Compared with other aircrafts, our radars have more range than any other. The Swedish government delivered to the Brazilian government documents of performance of these radars and its capabilities. In comparison with the Mirage, our radar is 5 times more powerful.

5 more powerful than the mirage ? What does that mean ?
Does he send 5 more powerful waves ?
Anyway, the mirage 2000 Br has an even newer radar than the Gripen

Originally posted by m.ileduets

Dinheiro: Embraer claims that only Dassault, the manufacturer of Mirage, is going to transfer technology do Brazil.
McNamee: This is not true

Right, sukhoi too

Originally posted by m.ileduets

Dinheiro: Are you willing to transfer technology.
McNamee: I want to emphasize that I don't know exactly what kind of technology transfer Embraer is talking about. Is it new technology. Is it old? I have no idea. We are prepared to transfer the technology of the most advanced software used in the aircraft. Our proposal to the Brazilian government gives all details about everything we would like to transfer. What we are going to transfer should allow the Brazilians to control the weapon systems that they are going to use.

software only ?

Originally posted by m.ileduets

Dinheiro: With Gripen, is Brazil able to open source-codes and therefore be able to control software?
McNamee: Yes. It is part of our proposal the transfer of technology which also includes the creation here in Brazil of a Gripen Development Center.

Very good point.

Originally posted by m.ileduets

Dinheiro: What else is Gripen offering?
McNamee: our aircraft is on its early stages of life. First delivery of such aircraft started now, some 4 months ago. What we are offering Brazil is an export version of an aircraft that is likely to be in operation for the next 30, 40 years, and to be used by several countries. I don't believe Mirage will stay in operation for the next 30, 40 years. Mirage does not simply have a path for upgrades. I would like to say that Mirage is not a bad aircraft. I just think that is it an old aircraft. It is an aircraft of an old generation.

About upgrade, that's more a lie than a mistake I think.
In 2044, mirage 2000 or Grippen, same thing, POS.

[glitter]

Originally posted by A-29
par Benelos/glitter

The delivery of the Rafale to the French AF has been postponed?

Depend of waht scheduling you're talking about

Originally posted by A-29

I guess that's the reason to keep and upgrade the M2000C and M2000-5 for more years than expected (I know that the D and N versions will remain in service for more years than the Air Defense version).

As I said before, the mirage 2000 will have a major upgrade a bit after 2010.
FADEC engine etc ...
Of course, it will be able to use most new french weapons like the AASM.

Originally posted by A-29

Its a good and combat proven aircraft, but, it cannot matches the Flanker and Gripen

In A2A ?

[the_baphomet_00]

Originally posted by GoldenDragon
Equador has HN-5s? I doubt that China can export military equipment to South America without getting a lot of attention from the US (especially things like MANPADs).

Hi GoldenDragon...!!

Here in south america, is well know that the ecuadorian armed forces have a mix of occidental and non-occidental AAA from diferents sources: U.S.A., Russia, Britain, Sweden, China and Czechia..

Well, because no one is the owner of the real and absolute true I´ll confirm all about the HN-5 in ecuadorian service and I´ll publish any aditional info here..

regards.

Alberto.-

[m.ileduets]

Originally posted by A-29
m.ileduets,


The fact is that the FX has been delayed so many times and the companies had plenty of time to improve their proposals. If the FX had its decision in the planned year which was 2002, no doubt that the Mirage 2000-5 would be the winner. But, the ones for the Flanker and Gripen are more attractive than for the M2000. Also, the pilots prefer the Gripen and the Flanker and this you have to take in consideration.

No matter who will be the winner, I'm sure that Embraer will be involved in the project.

Regards,

Right, OK. Thanks.
The information I read was probably mostly refering to earlier stages in the competition.
Mirage just got this reputation of selling "an old aircraft" (that's why it also dropped out of the Austrian tender), and if the competitors keep repeating it, it might actually work.

Wasn't Sukhoi lining up with a different manufacturer in Brazil?

[A-29]

Glitter,

I'm talking about the replacement of the Mirage 2000C and 2000-5 (The air defense versions). I read that the Rafale will replace them first and after that the attack versions (the D and N)

I think that you are mentioning the entire fleet of Mirages including the D and N versions.

Regards,

[A-29]

m.ileduets,

Yes, the company associated with Sukhoi is AVIBRAS.

Regards,

[A-29]

Hi Alberto,

Good news, tks for the info.
The jets will be overhauled in Belgium. They will get the same upgrade which means the MLU version? used by Belgium, Netherlands, Norway, Denmark and lately Portugal?

I hope that the current political situation could resolve rapidly and without problems and the F16s could come here for the Cruzex 2004.

Regards,

[m.ileduets]

Originally posted by glitter
$8,000 for a F-16 ? the block 60 I suppose ?
But, why didn't tell us how much for the mirage ??

Would be an interesting aspect. If he doesn't come up with Mirage figures it can only mean that the difference is marginal.

5 more powerful than the mirage ? What does that mean ?

I was wondering about that, too. But I can't imagine the Gripen having more powerful waves than the Su-35's. That thing is a monster. He must refer to sth. else. Can't be range either. Very questionable claim indeed.

About upgrade, that's more a lie than a mistake I think.
In 2044, mirage 2000 or Grippen, same thing, POS.

Well, I'm not so sure about that. The Gripen design is indeed a lot newer. Dassault developed a successor for the Mirage, so the incentive to upgrade is smaller on the long run. I guess it all depends on how well the Gripen sells in the near future.

[the_baphomet_00]

Originally posted by Camaro
hola alberto.
about the video...is it anywhere on the net? i've got to have it,
anyway is a Mi-8 as i said.
thanks beto.
Camaro.

Hi Camaro, I have the complete video, It was sent to me from Peru by a close friend of mine, sadly it is in VHS format.. let me find a computer with a video capture card and then I can share the video...

Regards...!!!

[the_baphomet_00]

Originally posted by A-29

The jets will be overhauled in Belgium. They will get the same upgrade which means the MLU version?

Nope, only the overhaul.. after that, a upgrade package will be signed with the israelis, some like the ACE program I guess...

Originally posted by A-29
I hope that the current political situation could resolve rapidly and without problems and the F16s could come here for the Cruzex 2004.

the same dude..!!!!

Regards..!!!

[A-29]

Hi Alberto,

Tks for the info.

Regards,

[glitter]

Originally posted by A-29
Glitter,

I'm talking about the replacement of the Mirage 2000C and 2000-5 (The air defense versions). I read that the Rafale will replace them first and after that the attack versions (the D and N)
,

Until 2010 the RAfale will be use to replace JAguar and Mirage F1.

Originally posted by m.ileduets
Would be an interesting aspect. If he doesn't come up with Mirage figures it can only mean that the difference is marginal.

http://www.mirage-jet.com/AIRFRAME/M...1/mainte_1.htm
"The direct operating costs average approximately US$ 2,700 per hour (compared with US$ 3600 for the F 16C Blk50). The Dash 5 requires 10 Maintenance Man Hours/ Per Flight Hour (MMH/FH). Only the Gripen does better, with SAAB quoting 7.6 hours MTBF. The Gripen requires 12 MMH/FH although this is set to come down to 10 hours. The Gripen direct operating costs average about US$ 2,000"

But remember of the M53 XP2 ...

http://www.tribuneindia.com/2001/20010513/edit.htm
"The data submitted by the armed forces indicates that the cost of a Mirage-2000 aircraft is over Rs 100 crore with per hour cost of flying being Rs 9.8 lakh and a Jaguar aircraft costs Rs 26.36 crore with per hour flying cost being Rs 2.6 lakhs"

I must say that I don't understand what Rs represent.
The problem is that I doubt a jaguar is cheaper to use per hour of flight.

[m.ileduets]

Let's try to broaden the horizon a bit: How will Brazil's choice affect stability in the area? Here's a few considerations:

The Su-35 is probably the most capable of the three front runners. It's expensive to fly and maintain, but it gives the most "bang" for the buck. What clearly distinguishes it from its competitor is its range and its payload. It makes it an excellent offensive asset. That's probably why the FAB likes it most. As somebody has pointed out, the Su-35 is an "airplane for times of war". If you have an asset like this, you want to use it. The flight hours are too expensive to be wasted on practice only.
The downside to this is that Brazil's neighbours would feel threatened. Brazil is the strongest power in SA. But up to now, there was no clear advantage in the air. This balance will tip. Countries like Argentina, Chile, Peru etc. would probably feel the need to protect themselves against such an offensive asset and enter an arms race. There would probably be an influx of advanced technology to counter the threat.

The Mirage is somewhere in between. It's A2G capabilities are well known, it has a larger payload than the Gripen, but the range is pretty much the same. Defensively it would be way superior to anything around in the area. It would increase Brazil's offensive assets, but not as significantly as with the Su-35. I don't think that Brazil's neighbours will feel threatened much.

The Gripen looks more like a small point defence fighter, even though it has offensive assets. Its payload is the lightest and its range fully loaded is clearly very limited. On the other hand, it's an excellent defensive asset with good sensors, data link, great situation awareness, and minimal logistical needs. But it would hardly increase Brazil's offensive assets, as an upgraded AMX would offer about the same performance.
Brazil's neighbours would probably be the happiest with this choice.

To sum things up in a very simplistic manner: If Brazil wants to go to war, it should opt for the Su-35; if it wants peace, it should buy the Gripen; if it wants to keep all options open, purchase the Mirage

Feel free to rip my assessment to pieces

By the way, can sb correct the title of the thread? It hurts my eyes every time I read it.

[Camaro]

m.ileduets...
actually what you said makes sense to me.
about anybody in the region feeling any danger, i seriously doubt it,
to me because on the enormous size of brazil, it makes sense to get the kinda' range that the Su-35 can give, and properly flown it can kick anybody's ass


alberto, thanks for the info and sure, i'm dying to have that video, thanks a million.
Camaro.

[A-29]

m.ileduets,

Your point is very interesting but weird......I disagree.

No matter which aircraft will be the winner, all of them are very capable and can be more than a match, if well flown, to any aircraft in the world. And talking not only in SA, but elsewhere.
Remember, Brazil is a peaceful country. We do not want to be aggressive with anyone, but, we have the right to have the best equipment available to defend ourselves. Just in case....you know.

Regards,

[m.ileduets]

Please don't misunderstand me: I'm not implying Brazil is not peaceful. I also agree that in the defensive role all three are pretty much equal and superior to anything around. It's just that the Su-35 clearly offers a big offensive potential.
Anywhere threat assessment usually considers the potential of a country, not only its "peacefullness" in history. So chosing the Su-35 would send a signal to surrounding countries. That's the way arms races are usually started.
What speaks against it (but nobody has mentioned this, so I'll do it to counter my own argument ) is the small number. 12 is hardly enough to do air defence, so unless you get a lot more, they don't pose a real offensive threat.

[A-29]

m.ileduets,

Sorry if I had rude, it was not the intention.
I understand your point, The SU-35 is much more a deterrent than the other ones and fits perfectly for us if you consider the size of Brazil (can goes from south to the north with just one A2A refuelling or using extra fuel tanks...none) and also the enormous quantity of weapons that the jet can carry. Taking consideration of what you wrote, it will be a response to the F-16C/D Block 50/52 purchased by the Chileans and also from the Mig-29/SU-25 from Peru. Did you agree with me?

Regards,



Ayrton Senna - to be remembered forever, simply the best

[glitter]

Originally posted by m.ileduets
The Su-35 is probably the most capable of the three front runners. It's expensive to fly and maintain, but it gives the most "bang" for the buck.

Cost of lifecycle = buying cost + cost of maintenance
If the Su-35 really reach more than 20 000$ per hour of flight and the airframe can sustain up to 8000hours of flight, the maintenance alone would be
8 000 x 20 000 = 160 000 000 dollars.

Not really a bang for the buck.

But as you said, his range and payload is really much better than Gripen or Mirage, it's up to Brazil if the governement think that the sukhoi is a must-have or not.

[Srbin]

Glitter i know you're really pro M2K, but even if Su-35 wasn't an option Gripen would still be better than M2K, so why?

-Gripen is a much newer airframe
-Gripen is cheaper(70mn) compared to M2K(70mn) and a little cheaper to maintain and fly
-About the same range
-it has a smaller payload which is not a extremely big thing

I really don't see why the M2K should go ahead instead of Gripen

Now as for SU-35, Su-35's high maintenance/flying hour cost makes up for it's really low cost to buy(35mn) and in the future if you run it for that many hours it really wouldn't be that expensive, and I likely doubt it costs that much(20000) to run/hour, thats ridicilously high. But lets say Su-35 does cost the same at the end of 8000 hours along with lets say M2K, it still offers much better capabilities than the little M2K. You could buy 20 Su-35s for 350mn and buy 10 M2K's for 700mn.

I don't see whats so much more offensive on the M2K than on the Gripen. And as much as you say it, M2KBR doesn't even exist not even as a prototype and who freaking knows what they'd put in it.

I always had a feeling Dassault on purpose stacked up M2K's cost up to 70mn because they felt it would get picked because they partnered with Embraer and were abusing that position, I really hope M2K looses just for that and not just the fact that the other two are better. Dassault should've put the price somewhere around 35-45mn otherwise M2K wouldn't be good if it costed as much as Gripen.