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Thread: Turkish aerospace

  1. #511
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    I am advised that the above path has been abandoned by the Turkish Navy in December 2016. This is the current situation with the TF-2000 AAW Class light destroyer/frigate.

    Local Air Defence Missile System For TF-2000
    https://turkishnavy.net/2016/12/05/l...m-for-tf-2000/


    Defence acquisition agency Undersecreteriat For Defence industries (UDI) has started a development project for air defence missiles to be used TF-2000 warship.
    According to the website of UDI, the aim of the project is to procure short/medium and long-range air defence missile, which can be integrated with the combat management system, multi-purpose phased array radar system and TF-2000 platform and capable of force and zone air defense.
    The project model is local development. There will be a short/medium ranged missile and a long ranged missile. The shot text also mentions the system of the missile. What we should understand from it is at the moment a bit unclear. The UDI states that a request for proposal regarding the design and development phase is under preparation.
    At the moment Turkey has developed two air defence missiles:
    Hisar-A low altitude missile system
    Hisar-O medium altitude missile system.
    These missiles were developed for the army to protect military bases, ports, facilities and troops against threats from the air. Their targets are military aircraft, attack helicopters, cruise missiles and unmanned aerial vehicles. According to Roketsan producer of the missiles, they present a modular structure with the integrity of a family and are designed to be compatible with different platform integrations.
    Both missiles have high explosive fragment warhead, mid-course guidance with inertial navigation and data link terminal guidance with IIR (imaging infrared seeker). The range of Hisar-A is 15 km and the range of Hisar-O is 25km. It is too early to say, whether the recently announced naval air defence missiles will be developed from the existing Hisar missiles or build from the scratch.
    The command and control and fire control systems for the land based Hisar air defence system is done by military electronics company Aselsan. Aselsan is also developing the phased array radar to be used for the TF-2000 air defence frigate. Thus the development of the electronics for the air defence system will be carried out by them.
    With the initiation of this project, Turkey takes another step to the realisation of TF-2000 air defence frigate.
    Last edited by Bayar; 16th July 2017 at 13:45.

  2. #512
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    JSR wrote: "you have been corrected several times regarding technical parameters about Russian systems."

    I am as prone to error as anyone, but do not take 'corrections' seriously if they are based on near-worthless sources such as Sputnik and RT. No-one in the open-source intelligence community pays any attention to either of these organisations.

    The story that you linked to shows just how out of touch with reality Sputnik is. It explains how the Buk M3 system "was first closely showcased at the international military-technical forum Army-2016... The existence of the system was later confirmed by Russia's Defense Minister Sergei Shoigu".

    By 2016 nobody needed any confirmation that Buk M3 existed. The earliest document in my files that mentions Buk M3 dates to late 2014, but the West had been aware that system existed for several years before that date. Jane's had published a photo of a Buk M3 TEL at least a year before the 'Army 2016' exhibition.
    Mercurius Cantabrigiensis

  3. #513
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    OK.. and what does it change?

  4. #514
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    It only change the subject not the substance . He already attracted BIO and TR-1 with his statements. I believe buk-M3 already has naval version . It is followed up with S350 navalized and than S500. There is clear technology path.

  5. #515
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    bring_it_on wrote: "Have you gone through each and every PAC-3, and PAC-3 MSE intercept made public?"

    Obviously not! My brain must not have been fully on-line when I wrote that posting - good evidence that an old man's memory is far from reliable. I had also forgotten that the Russian 9M96 series use gas-dynamic control in the later stages of flight. (All MANPADS outside of the latest generation are contact fuzed, as are early models of Rapier, but the original discussion was talking about medium and heavy SAMs.)
    Thanks. BTW, is there a good source for the Aster-30s Ballistic Missile target intercept record and what the TBM test series looks like for the weapon and program (number of engagements, type of targets, number of targets etc etc)?
    Last edited by bring_it_on; 17th July 2017 at 02:51.
    Old radar types never die; they just phased array

  6. #516
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    There is no single source that I am aware of. Before my semi-retirement I used to have on-line access to the Jane's magazines. Their 'Missiles & Rockets' (or was it 'Rockets and Missiles' - I cannot remember which one was the Jane's title and which was the US magazine published in the late fifties and early sixties) used to report most of the Aster test firings soon after each happened. But like several of the other more-specialised Jane's titles, it was closed several years ago.
    Mercurius Cantabrigiensis

  7. #517
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    Besides Israel, Turkey remains the only Asian nation to fly the F-35 aircraft,
    Doh! Someone should tell Japan & S. Korea.
    Juris praecepta sunt haec: honeste vivere, alterum non laedere, suum cuique tribuere.
    Justinian

  8. #518
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    Don’t forget that the largest X band radar currently in production has made the switch to GaN and all subsequent deliveries at s rate of one to two sets a year (depending upon export orders) will be using GaN. The first radar post the switch is currently being made and will be delivered over the next few months. In addition to the nations mentioned above and the U.S. that has the largest GaN portfolio of sensors in development in the world, Israel too has significant capability to produce and deliver long range radars utilizing GaN.
    Indeed. I named Sweden, the Netherlands & Italy because their capabilities may not be as well known as other countries, particularly big ones. Japan's another obvious example.
    Juris praecepta sunt haec: honeste vivere, alterum non laedere, suum cuique tribuere.
    Justinian

  9. #519
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    Bayar wrote: "Turkey-NATO relations will never be the same as pre-15 July 2016. The fact that coup sided F-16's were refueled from NATO bases..."

    My understanding was that the refuelling was done by a Turkish AF KC-135R tanker aircraft from 101 Filo operating out of Incirlik. You cannot blame NATO for an air operation apparently conducted by the host nation's aircraft from an airfield on the host nation's territory.
    Well said, Mercurius.

    Doubtless he'd complain bitterly if any of Turkey's NATO allies tried to prevent Turkish air force aircraft taking off from bases in Turkey it allows those allies to use. It'd be a gross infringement of Turkish sovereignty.
    Juris praecepta sunt haec: honeste vivere, alterum non laedere, suum cuique tribuere.
    Justinian

  10. #520
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    There is no single source that I am aware of. Before my semi-retirement I used to have on-line access to the Jane's magazines. Their 'Missiles & Rockets' (or was it 'Rockets and Missiles' - I cannot remember which one was the Jane's title and which was the US magazine published in the late fifties and early sixties) used to report most of the Aster test firings soon after each happened. But like several of the other more-specialised Jane's titles, it was closed several years ago.
    Thanks Merc. I did go through Jane's Missiles & Rockets and other references but could find only 3 missile intercepts till date (one developmental and 2 with operational crews), one each in 2010 and 2011 and another in 2013. All against Rafael's Black Sparrow air launched weapon. I couldn't find any additional tests or higher intensity tests etc so was wondering if there was a more comprehensive list somewhere or if additional testing has even occurred.
    Last edited by bring_it_on; 17th July 2017 at 20:16.
    Old radar types never die; they just phased array

  11. #521
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    Much awaited details on the TF-X Engine and the new Turkish Air Engine Company (TAEC), a 51% Kale Group, 49% Rolls-Royce joint-venture.

    Rolls-Royce: "We have already received export licences" from the British Government for the engine technology transfer to Turkey.

    It will be a next generation engine with thrust-vectoring?

    "Director of Rolls-Royce's Defense Group Mr. Chris Cholerton expressed that they were happy to seize the opportunity to collaborate with Kale Group within the scope of the Turkish Fighter Program to develop an indigenous engine, the Intellectual Property Rights of which will entirely be possessed by Turkey and which will not be subject to export restrictions"




    Last edited by Bayar; 18th July 2017 at 13:58.

  12. #522
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    ASELSAN begins working on sub-systems development and integration at its new facilities allocated for TF-X work.



    Another TF-X rendering


  13. #523
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    It will be interesting to see if that changes once the BAE engineers get their feet under the table.

  14. #524
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    https://lenta.ru/news/2017/07/18/noway/

    Chemezov- production of S-400 in Turkey is impossible in the near future.
    http://img818.imageshack.us/img818/9098/rsz11rsz3807.jpg

  15. #525
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    По его данным, речь идет о продаже четырех дивизионов системы на общую сумму около 2,5 миллиарда долларов. Два дивизиона должны быть переданы в готовом из России в течение двух лет с момента подписания контракта, а еще два — собраны в Турции.
    "We are talking about the sale of four divisions of the system for a total of about 2.5 billion dollars. Two divisions must be transferred in ready-made from Russia within two years from the date of signing the contract, and two more are assembled in Turkey"

    It remains to be seen to what extent Turkish Industry will be involved in the S-400 production. No one is claiming that Turkey will receive a ToT for all the technology involved. Turkey is only interested in the rocket propulsion system technology.

  16. #526
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    Turkey continues deployment to Qatar-begins deployment of heavy artillery units. Al Udeid Air Base now has a new neighbour.

    Two NATO (US and Turkey) allies side by side in Qatar, Somalia and Djibouti.



    Last edited by Bayar; 19th July 2017 at 04:32.

  17. #527
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    The deal between Turkey and EUROSAM is not for the Aster 30 but a new long-range Air Defence system to be developed by Italy-France-Turkey based on the STAMP/T

    Turkey, close to S-400 deal, also goes for Eurosam solution
    By: Burak Ege Bekdil, July 18, 2017 (Photo Credit: Photo by Chip Somodevilla/Getty Images)
    http://www.defensenews.com/articles/...rosam-solution

    ANKARA — Every new day Turkey and Russia are inching closer to a final deal on the Turkish acquisition of the Russian-made S-400 air defense architecture. But the Ankara government also said it reached a deal with the European group Eurosam to develop a similar air and anti-missile defense system.

    Rostec, the Russian company brokering the S-400 deal, has said that Ankara and Moscow agreed on all technical matters for the S-400 program – which US officials warn and Turkish authorities admit would not be interoperable with the U.S. and NATO assets deployed on Turkish soil. Turkish ambassador to Moscow, Huseyin Dirioz, has said that the Turkish work to assess the Russian solution is continuing.

    “The S-400 solution stems from [Turkey’s] urgent requirement,” Turkish Defense Minister Fikri Isik said.

    But Isik also said that Turkey and Eurosam have agreed to jointly develop a similar air and anti-missile defense system “in line with Turkey’s requirements.”

    “This [Eurosam program] is a high-caliber and big project … involving research and development and co-production,” Isik said. “Turkey, Italy and France will seek to define the [air defense] requirement for all three countries.” Eurosam is a majority Italian-French partnership.

    Earlier this year the Turkish government said it may buy the S-400 for its near-mystery program to build the country’s first long-range air and anti-missile defense system.

    For its long-range air defense system, dubbed T-LORAMIDS, Turkey in September 2013 selected China Precision Machinery Import-Export Corporation’s $3.44 billion solution, which defeated rival bids from Eurosam, maker of the SAMP/T; a consortium of Lockheed Martin and Raytheon, maker of the Patriot system; and the Russian-made S-300/S-400 option.

    Under pressure from its NATO allies, Turkey later scrapped the preliminary deal with CPMIEC and the competition. Since then Ankara has held talks with the Western contenders, but it also commissioned two domestic state-controlled companies, Aselsan and Roketsan, to locally develop the system.

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