Key.Aero Network
Register Free

Page 5 of 16 FirstFirst 12345678915 ... LastLast
Results 121 to 150 of 455

Thread: Shenyang J-21/31/F-60/AMF thread part 1

  1. #121
    Join Date
    Jun 2012
    Posts
    483
    Quote Originally Posted by Inst View Post
    "I doubt lockheed-martin would network anything sensitive in a position where it can be "hacked" through the internet."

    This is why the Lockmart hacking incident is so embarrassing.

    Off on other forums, we already have the J-31's specifications; it's about 11.5 meters in wingspan; announced by the ******* trucking company!

    Wing loading on the J-31 is likely going to be less than on the F-22 and more than the F-35; it's the low-end aspect of the J-20/J-31 mix.
    If it's wingspan is really 11.5 meters, then its engines cannot be derived from WS-10 / 15 but rather from the smaller WS-13. It has the same shape as F-35 but is instead twin-engined so if its engines are WS-10 sized then its wingspan should be over 13.5 meters.
    Last edited by Goldust; 20th September 2012 at 15:49.

  2. #122
    Join Date
    Apr 2006
    Posts
    696
    also, all those images of fuselage under tarp being transported around china were pretty indicative of the plane size and all pointed to something 15-16 meters long with wings 11 or so meters wide.

    i dont see anything strange with this plane using two ws13 engines. heck, maybe right now it is using two rd-93 engines. The nozzles on the images sure do look a lot like rd-93.

  3. #123
    Join Date
    Jan 2011
    Posts
    945
    Quote Originally Posted by Sundog View Post
    Considering China hacked Lockheed-Martins servers, looking for information on a still classified program, and downloaded everything on the F-22 and F-35 while they were at it, you're not far off. Of course, we (The public) never found out if they got the information on the classified program they were trying to get the tech on.
    Not everything, the evidence suggests data only for the F-35 front and F-22 fins

    LM & Co. need to install this:

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3u5u5A8_SE0

  4. #124
    Join Date
    Jan 2011
    Posts
    996
    Quote Originally Posted by Tigershark View Post
    navy mig29 has no chance against j31 now that we confirm it is a navy aircraft

    This has to have come from a Pakistani fan...or just a piece meant for certain Indian forums by a Chinese guy who got beaten up by the mods & member in Indian forum. As far as I seen, Chinese hardly care about Indian military as much as Indian care about Pakistani military. Its always the smaller guy bothering about the bigger & stronger ones which we see in online forums.
    In Pakistani forums - its paranoid, jealously, bad mouthing & competing with India.
    In Indian forums - its paranoid, jealousy, bad mouthing & competing with China
    Last edited by JangBoGo; 20th September 2012 at 20:40.

  5. #125
    Join Date
    Jan 2006
    Location
    .de
    Posts
    1,859
    Quote Originally Posted by JangBoGo View Post
    This has to have come from a Pakistani fan...or just a piece meant for certain Indian forums by a Chinese guy who got beaten up by the mods & member in Indian forum. As far as I seen, Chinese hardly care about Indian military as much as Indian care about Pakistani military. Its always the smaller guy bothering about the bigger & stronger ones which we see in online forums.
    In Pakistani forums - its paranoid, jealously, bad mouthing & competing with India.
    In Indian forums - its paranoid, jealousy, bad mouthing & competing with China
    That MiG-29 should in fact be a Japanese F-2, should it not?
    Patrick

  6. #126
    Join Date
    Jul 2003
    Posts
    145
    Quote Originally Posted by Rasputin814 View Post
    This is pretty laughable. You simply don't just "download" the blueprints of a modern 5th generation fighter off a server. At best they had access to some design discussion memo's or emails. I doubt lockheed-martin would network anything sensitive in a position where it can be "hacked" through the internet.
    You fail to understand I'm simply reporting actual news that was covered in Aviation Week. It was an extreme lack of network security on L-M's part. There wasn't anything laughable about it.

  7. #127
    Join Date
    Oct 2010
    Location
    Australia
    Posts
    2,159

    Wink

    Quote Originally Posted by JangBoGo View Post
    Its always the smaller guy bothering about the bigger & stronger ones which we see in online forums.
    In Pakistani forums - its paranoid, jealously, bad mouthing & competing with India.
    In Indian forums - its paranoid, jealousy, bad mouthing & competing with China
    Now explain America's obsession with Russia, Iran, Cuba...

  8. #128
    Join Date
    Nov 2009
    Posts
    2,022
    Quote Originally Posted by Rii View Post
    Now explain America's obsession with Russia, Iran, Cuba...
    It's simple ...for instance Cuba, have you seen the ginormous invasion forces always at the shores threatening to jump in their numerous landing vessel to invade the decent, peace loving honest and kind and innocent freedom loving american people and the huge numbers of battlegroups of the cuban navy , like, carriers and battleships dude! Besides everyone knows that evil Cuba is behind all the terrorists in the world man! They are a threat man!

    ***megalomaniac hypocrites.

    Anyway we digress...really hope to see more of this aircraft. Btw something that gets me thinking about both J-20 and J-31. Shouldn't they have IRST to help better opose the american 5th gens? Nothing of the like is obvious on both , but perhaps not yet since they are only prototypes as of now. What do you think , will the J-20 and J-31 have IRST?

  9. #129
    Join Date
    Jun 2012
    Posts
    483
    Quote Originally Posted by mack8 View Post
    Anyway we digress...really hope to see more of this aircraft. Btw something that gets me thinking about both J-20 and J-31. Shouldn't they have IRST to help better opose the american 5th gens? Nothing of the like is obvious on both , but perhaps not yet since they are only prototypes as of now. What do you think , will the J-20 and J-31 have IRST?
    I believe they do have retractable IRST which get deployed when the distance to a target is near enough.

  10. #130
    Join Date
    Dec 2010
    Posts
    18
    Quote Originally Posted by Goldust View Post
    I believe they do have retractable IRST which get deployed when the distance to a target is near enough.
    Both appear to have diamond-ish shaped sensors(or at least potential place-holders for sensors) built into the fuselage, indicating that they're likely designed to use something like the EODAS instead of IRST. It's pretty obvious on the J-20, not very clear on the J-31 yet though.

  11. #131
    Join Date
    Nov 2009
    Posts
    2,022
    Bai Wei via J10@CDF
    Attached Thumbnails Attached Thumbnails Click image for larger version. 

Name:	5f6ff8c9jw1dx2kzkxaqrj.jpg 
Views:	6479 
Size:	53.8 KB 
ID:	208381   Click image for larger version. 

Name:	5f6ff8c9jw1dx3rym19bbj.jpg 
Views:	5466 
Size:	60.8 KB 
ID:	208382  

  12. #132
    Join Date
    Jul 2005
    Location
    Westkerke, Belgium
    Posts
    404
    i was expecting this to happen, especially after ive seen a picture of a CATIC mockup a few years back


  13. #133
    Join Date
    May 2004
    Location
    Germany
    Posts
    3,447
    It is worth noting that the real aircraft does not match the model in some important respects (canopy, landing gear, engines, wing trailing edge control surfaces). I do agree that the beefy nose landing gear may indicate carrier-basing, although in that case the absence of a catapult launch bar is interesting (suggesting a catapult carrier may be some ways in the future still).
    Last edited by Trident; 21st September 2012 at 20:07.

  14. #134
    Join Date
    Dec 2010
    Posts
    1,187
    Quote Originally Posted by mack8 View Post
    Bai Wei via J10@CDF
    the resemblance to the F-35 is stunning..just the F-22 style vertical fins and the the twin engines make it look a bit different..

  15. #135
    Join Date
    Jun 2012
    Posts
    483
    Quote Originally Posted by BlackArcher View Post
    the resemblance to the F-35 is stunning..just the F-22 style vertical fins and the the twin engines make it look a bit different..
    I second that. Wonder how much AVIC paid LM for F-35 blueprints?

  16. #136
    Join Date
    Oct 2010
    Posts
    5,393
    Quote Originally Posted by BlackArcher View Post
    the resemblance to the F-35 is stunning..just the F-22 style vertical fins and the the twin engines make it look a bit different..
    If you went out of your way to make an F-22/F-35 hybrid, that is what you would get.

    Not accusing it being a "copy" (of what? 2 aircraft mix isn't a copy), but....yeah. No denying it.
    http://img818.imageshack.us/img818/9098/rsz11rsz3807.jpg

  17. #137
    Join Date
    Jan 2011
    Location
    ShangHai
    Posts
    554
    overview.
    Attached Images Attached Images  
    The truth usually between two extremes, the key is when and where.

  18. #138
    Join Date
    May 2005
    Posts
    3,418
    Can't wait to see it take off.

    Nic
    "allah akbar": NATO's new warcry.

  19. #139
    Join Date
    Jan 2011
    Location
    ShangHai
    Posts
    554
    take off what? lol
    this aircraft is belong to project 310, therefor, the official designation won't be J-31
    The truth usually between two extremes, the key is when and where.

  20. #140
    Join Date
    Nov 2005
    Posts
    1,106
    just commenting on one thing here and I'm not saying anyone is really guilty of it, but I've seen the claim that SAC managed to design this aircraft based on the information they hacked from Lockheed everywhere on the internet.

    If anyone has seriously followed SAC's struggles in developing J-11B, J-15 and J-16, they would have less confidence in SAC's copying abilities. China has had Su-27s for 20 years and all of the technical documentations and production line for Su-27s for 16 years and they've only barely managed to deliver J-11B into service for about 2 years. And based on J-11B performance in the past year, it's hard for me to call this project a success. And that's when they've got all the blue prints, production tooling, Russian produced parts. And somehow, some people believe SAC can just somehow magically reproduce an aircraft just relying on data they hacked from Lockheed Martin despite have totally different engines, aircraft material, design objectives and electronics.

    Also, even though CAC and SAC are competitors within AVIC-1, they are still cooperative in the sense that they do share designs. For example, SAC is said to have been fairly involved with the J-20 project.
    Visit my Chinese military blog at http://china-pla.blogspot.com/

  21. #141
    Join Date
    Jun 2012
    Posts
    483
    Quote Originally Posted by tphuang View Post
    just commenting on one thing here and I'm not saying anyone is really guilty of it, but I've seen the claim that SAC managed to design this aircraft based on the information they hacked from Lockheed everywhere on the internet.

    If anyone has seriously followed SAC's struggles in developing J-11B, J-15 and J-16, they would have less confidence in SAC's copying abilities. China has had Su-27s for 20 years and all of the technical documentations and production line for Su-27s for 16 years and they've only barely managed to deliver J-11B into service for about 2 years. And based on J-11B performance in the past year, it's hard for me to call this project a success. And that's when they've got all the blue prints, production tooling, Russian produced parts. And somehow, some people believe SAC can just somehow magically reproduce an aircraft just relying on data they hacked from Lockheed Martin despite have totally different engines, aircraft material, design objectives and electronics.

    Also, even though CAC and SAC are competitors within AVIC-1, they are still cooperative in the sense that they do share designs. For example, SAC is said to have been fairly involved with the J-20 project.
    Politics run deeper than what is reported in the media. The Democratic party shares similar ideologies with China's Communist party. I wouldn't be surprise if there's quite a bit of under the table deals between China and the US.

  22. #142
    Join Date
    Oct 2010
    Posts
    5,393
    Quote Originally Posted by Goldust View Post
    Politics run deeper than what is reported in the media. The Democratic party shares similar ideologies with China's Communist party. I wouldn't be surprise if there's quite a bit of under the table deals between China and the US.
    lol.
    http://img818.imageshack.us/img818/9098/rsz11rsz3807.jpg

  23. #143
    Join Date
    Aug 2005
    Posts
    702
    The Red menace is everywhere :diablo:

    BTW, congratulations to the Chinese. They're obviously putting a serious effort in their aviation industry.

  24. #144
    Join Date
    Nov 2011
    Posts
    1,016
    Quote Originally Posted by Goldust View Post
    Politics run deeper than what is reported in the media. The Democratic party shares similar ideologies with China's Communist party. I wouldn't be surprise if there's quite a bit of under the table deals between China and the US.
    MP.net, it has invaded! (Atleast mack8 will get the joke :P)

  25. #145
    Join Date
    Sep 2012
    Posts
    13
    just commenting on one thing here and I'm not saying anyone is really guilty of it, but I've seen the claim that SAC managed to design this aircraft based on the information they hacked from Lockheed everywhere on the internet.

    If anyone has seriously followed SAC's struggles in developing J-11B, J-15 and J-16, they would have less confidence in SAC's copying abilities. China has had Su-27s for 20 years and all of the technical documentations and production line for Su-27s for 16 years and they've only barely managed to deliver J-11B into service for about 2 years. And based on J-11B performance in the past year, it's hard for me to call this project a success. And that's when they've got all the blue prints, production tooling, Russian produced parts. And somehow, some people believe SAC can just somehow magically reproduce an aircraft just relying on data they hacked from Lockheed Martin despite have totally different engines, aircraft material, design objectives and electronics.

    Also, even though CAC and SAC are competitors within AVIC-1, they are still cooperative in the sense that they do share designs. For example, SAC is said to have been fairly involved with the J-20 project.
    excatly. All the people who think China can simply hack the f-35 design servers and download the blueprints to the f-35 as if it were a torrent obviously have no idea of how aerospace engineering works, or for that matter any type of advanced technical engineering. This simply does not happen. A much much more likely scenario is that they have been studying American airforce doctrine and designs for many years now and have decided to follow in its footsteps. This means they have been studying public available data on the f-35 and f-22. This can range from videos and any data they can get their hands on that is not classified. From these videos, they can clearly see the shaping and get a general idea of the flight characteristic of these platforms. If lockheed martin has been compromised, it is most likely design memo's/emails and very few limited detailed data on design choices. But this is far less important that what is already readily available to them, videos. From this they can slowly research why the f-35 and f-22 are shaped the way they are and the compromises each aircraft went through. You can think of it this way. Think of it as a test question. They know the question. They have a rough idea of what the answer is. They need not the full answer, but the steps required to get the answer. From this they can make their own design choices and learn from the so called "mistakes" that the US went through. It simply makes sense to learn from the best. There is not point in reinventing the wheel.
    __________________
    Last edited by Rasputin814; 23rd September 2012 at 06:19.

  26. #146
    Join Date
    Aug 2007
    Posts
    2,173
    Quote Originally Posted by Goldust View Post
    Politics run deeper than what is reported in the media. The Democratic party shares similar ideologies with China's Communist party. I wouldn't be surprise if there's quite a bit of under the table deals between China and the US.
    The Democratic Party shares ideology with China´s Communist Party and with the MLM (Mars Libertarian Movement) ...


  27. #147
    Join Date
    Dec 2008
    Location
    Norway
    Posts
    3,681
    L o L

    I too don't see the Chinese Aviation Industry over take the Russian, never mind Euro/US within the next 30 years.
    I'm not talking about manpower and the production rate, but rather the inovation and hi-tech R&D programs. for Engines, metalurgy Radar and optics sensors.
    While the Chinese Aviation industry are catching up, its not like the rest of the world are standing still..

    Be that as it may, an congratulation is in order here.
    Well done both CAC and SAC.
    Last edited by haavarla; 23rd September 2012 at 12:29.
    Thanks

  28. #148
    Join Date
    Dec 2010
    Location
    China
    Posts
    129
    Quote Originally Posted by Sintra View Post
    The Democratic Party shares ideology with China´s Communist Party and with the MLM (Mars Libertarian Movement) ...

    Karl Max is very unhappy. Cause he didn't have a US MBA degree.
    Dude, careful with the word "ideology".

    By the way, trying using emule and resource search for "LM"or "F35 fighter", you will find someone did forget to reset thier share folder to D://porn instead of E://mailbox backup.

    Many P2P clients are very active portal ways. Governments & institutions & hackers & telecom companies & software companies check your computer every day.
    Last edited by thinkplum; 23rd September 2012 at 13:07.

  29. #149
    Join Date
    Aug 2007
    Posts
    2,173
    Quote Originally Posted by thinkplum View Post
    Karl Max is very unhappy. Cause he didn't have a US MBA degree.
    Karl Marx is dead... The chap died in 1883...

    Quote Originally Posted by thinkplum View Post
    Dude, careful with the word "ideology".
    IDEOLOGY; IDEOLOGY; IDEOLOGY...


    OH NO, i am being attacked by mutant Green Martians, equiped with Democratic Party stickers... (Translated from Portuguese)

    Quote Originally Posted by thinkplum View Post
    By the way, trying using emule and resource search for "LM"or "F35 fighter", you will find someone did forget to reset thier share folder to D://porn instead of E://mailbox backup.
    ?

    Quote Originally Posted by thinkplum View Post
    Many P2P clients are very active portal ways. Governments & institutions & hackers & telecom companies & software companies check your computer every day.
    You´ve just won a Nobel Prize, thats an amazing discovery...


    Now can we go back to the latest Chinese Bird? (yes, yes, i am quite aware that i´ve helped more than a litle to "deviate" the topic)

  30. #150
    Join Date
    Nov 2009
    Posts
    2,022
    Bai Wei again via J10
    Attached Images Attached Images  

Thread Information

Users Browsing this Thread

There are currently 1 users browsing this thread. (0 members and 1 guests)

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •  

- Part of the    Network -

KEY AERO AVIATION NEWS

MAGAZINES

AVIATION FORUM

SHOP

 

WEBSITES