Could 'Virgin Europe' be the next in the Virgin franchise?

[Matt-100]

Speaking in May, Richard Branson stated he wanted to compete with British Airways on key short haul routes.
These included both domestic routes to Edinburgh and Aberdeen and regional routes to Nice, Moscow, Cairo and Riyadh.

Earlier this month, Virgin Atlantic announced they plan to initiate flights to Moscow from 2013 - however, this still leaves the other 5 destinations up for discussion.
As it stands, I find it highly unlikely that VS could use its current wide-body aircraft on short flights to Edinburgh, Aberdeen and Nice. Which begs the question, could Virgin be planing a new European airline altogether operating narrow-bodies?

The Virgin group has tried breaking the European travel market twice before (Virgin Express 1996, Virgin Sun Airlines 1998) - however, with the recent success of both Virgin America and Virgin Australia and the recent advances in the in-flight experience (AVOD, mood-lighting, etc.), a new European Virgin airline could really revolutionize the European air travel market.

Richard Branson likes innovation, and the list of 'firsts' that would go with a Virgin Europe would be extensive (for example, 'the first scheduled European airline to offer PTV screens in economy on inter-European flights').

My guess is, if Virgin is planning a regional European franchise they will wait until Heathrow gets its 3rd runway approval. Which last month David Cameron hinted could be granted in 2015. +2 years for construction and we're looking at 2017. This would fit in with an order for next generation (NEO/MAX) narrow-bodies.

I'll finish with a few comments regarding European short haul ops from the man himself, Richard Branson, speaking in April/May - for a man that likes a challenge and a good bash at BA it wouldn't surprise me if he did have something on the table?...

"The Virgin brand has a massive resonance with consumers. We can be reasonably confident that if we offer a different mix of routes people will find it attractive."
"We would expect to bring enough elements of the Virgin style that people would know they were on a Virgin aircraft, enjoying a Virgin service. It would be recognisably Virgin."
"We have plenty of experience of building domestic airlines with Virgin America and Virgin Australia. We will give BA a good run for their money."

[Giblets]

My guess is, if Virgin is planning a regional European franchise they will wait until Heathrow gets its 3rd runway approval. Which last month David Cameron hinted could be granted in 2015. +2 years for construction and we're looking at 2017. This would fit in with an order for next generation (NEO/MAX) narrow-bodies.

On the other hand, its nothing we haven't heard from Richard Branson. He does enjoy bashing BA, but putting those promises into action?!!?!!

If he wasn't getting the slots for free, he wouldn't be going to Moscow. PTV's in Europe, unlikely when every other carrier is having to cut costs.
As for Virgin service, you only need to look on skytrax to see that is going down the pan.

[Matt-100]

Indeed, Richard Branson is one of the great industry self-publicists along with the likes of Michael O'Leary. Most of the stuff he comes out with is just hot air. But, from a business perspective, a 2017 launch of a new European airline would be a shrewd move.

By then a lot of competition would have been siphoned off due to the aftershocks of the global down turn.

Virgin America has already taken the US by storm, with average load factors hitting upwards of 90% on domestic flights. This success (in such a tough economic climate) can be contributed to the unique, modern, and novel in-flight experience.
Europe doesn't have any airline with the same unique style as Virgin America. PTV's/mood lighting/recaro seating, though costly, certainly get bums on seats (especially when you're the only one doing it).
The high load factors ultimately subsidize the cost of the PTV systems, so the additional costs transferred to the passenger are negligible.
I don't know about anyone else but I'd certainly give a European Virgin America style airline a go?

You mention Skytrax, so, let's look at Skytrax. Virgin America and Australia both have a customer rating double that of Virgin Atlantic. Whilst VS has declined in recent years, there's no denying the new regional Virgin airlines are a cut above the rest.

[Bmused55]

You seem to expect the same success from Virgin America is guaranteed for a Virgin Europe.

Experience shows that success in one field does not guarantee success in another.

[Agent K]

Seems to have been written by a VS PR person, it's so biased?!

Getting real, this is real business and a tough business, and a multi-billion $ business, it's not a playground fight about bashing BA or any others. It's ruthless and yes RB is as much as any others. If it makes business sense, if the business case shows a return on investment then it may happen, if not it won't, simply that at the end of the day it has to make money or it won't happen, nobody is going to pour money into some venture that won't work.

[tenthije]

Branson had his chance when BMI came up for sale. He was not interested then, so I doubt he is really interested now.

[cloud_9]

To say that SRB was "not interested" is wrong tenthije, instead I would suggest that he was very much interested in aquiring the assets of BD, however he was not prepared to pay the price that LH had in mind, which is why they agreed the deal with IAG/BA last year.

In my personal opinion though, I was hoping/praying that SRB was successful in aquiring the assets of BD and doing just as Matt-100 suggested by launching a new "Virgin European" carrier, combined with making some changes at VS too, such as ordering new 777-300ER's and changing its business model to be more in-line with the likes of Virgin Australia..

If the European market is to see a carrier similar to the likes of Virgin America, I think it would have to come from a brand new entrant airline.

[Giblets]

Perhaps a little more interesting, and am sure we will hear Richard Branson crying out about the injustice soon, but I don't think he will be allowed to get the BD slots on this route. Why...?

The agreement stated that an airline must not have currently unused slots (or know they are coming into them) if they want to take the old BD ones. Currently Virgin lease out a number of slots (to Continental or United I believe).

This then begs the question, if Branson is so keen to expand Virgin, why did he lease the slots out instead of growing the airline?
The truth of the matter is there were also plenty of slots up for grabs, the fact that BA and many other airlines managed to expand their operations pre-BD is testament to the fact, add this to the fact that Virgin are currently leasing out some of their slots only backs this up.

I believe he had the opportunity to buy BD when LH bought them too, and declined.

[atr42]

Around the time the original CityFlyer was up for sale (late 90's) Mr B objected to BA buying them. There was speculation he wanted them with all the established routes but nothing came of it.
Let's be honest. The majors (including VS) and the airports want international customers through their hubs ie Yanks (no offence intended) coming to Europe via Heathrow. Therefore they will only be interested in pax going to major EU destinations rather than a full short haul network including people traveling between EU destinations. That is more the realm of loco's these days.
Therefore I don't really see much opportunity for him to set up a regional airline unless he wants to start competing with the BA network and the loco's. Sounds like more money down the drain to me.