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Thread: ROK F-X III Competition

  1. #1
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    ROK F-X III Competition

    I was reading in the latest AFM that the F-X III competition is well underway, and I had some thoughts on the candidates.

    The article stated the contenders are:
    • F-35
    • Typhoon
    • F-15SE


    It also stated that deliveries should begin in 2016 and all 60 should be delivered by 2020.

    Since F-35 production seems to slow down with every passing month, and the F-15 SE is still essentially a paper aircraft, does this just leave the Typhoon? I did a little reading around and some sources said Gripen is also in the running, so does this essentially come down to the two eurocanards, or will the ROKAF be willing to extend their deadlines to get US aircraft?
    "Quicquid agas age"

  2. #2
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    Quote Originally Posted by jbritchford View Post
    I was reading in the latest AFM that the F-X III competition is well underway, and I had some thoughts on the candidates.

    The article stated the contenders are:
    • F-35
    • Typhoon
    • F-15SE


    It also stated that deliveries should begin in 2016 and all 60 should be delivered by 2020.

    Since F-35 production seems to slow down with every passing month, and the F-15 SE is still essentially a paper aircraft, does this just leave the Typhoon? I did a little reading around and some sources said Gripen is also in the running, so does this essentially come down to the two eurocanards, or will the ROKAF be willing to extend their deadlines to get US aircraft?
    It will snow in Ougadougou before a Typhoon wears the marks of the South Korean Air Force (by obvious reasons, if the proverbial s***t hits the fan, it wont be the Black Watch or Wing 31 “Boelcke” who will be doing the fighting around parallel 38).
    Its either the F-35 or an evolved Eagle, Eurofighter should simply grow some sense and forget Korea.

  3. #3
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    Politically I don't think it's likely either, but would the F-15SE or F-35 be able to come anywhere close to the timeline the ROKAF have set?
    "Quicquid agas age"

  4. #4
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    Quote Originally Posted by jbritchford View Post
    Politically I don't think it's likely either, but would the F-15SE or F-35 be able to come anywhere close to the timeline the ROKAF have set?
    Who cares? the F-35 couldn't meet the timeline that JASDF had set a few years ago either. But finally, it was JASDF that changed the timeline "twice" (2014 --> 2016 --> 2017/18) to meet F-35......:diablo:

    Are you wishing that ROKAF will have more guts than JASDF when facing the mighty USA ??
    Last edited by toan; 7th March 2012 at 14:10.

  5. #5
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    if they keep the timeline, they'll probably just get some more F-15Ks and that will be it... otherwise, uncle sam will explain them that they will but the F-35 a bit later and they'll do so.

    I can't even understand why Eurofighter consortium wastes their time and money on that joke

  6. #6
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    With all that money thrown away for all those pointless east asian competitions, they could have integrated at least two weapons.

    Now they throw away even more money for salesman, instead of product improvement.


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    Agree...to a point. On the other hand, its probably better to just show up for the party anyway and see how things go rather than not bothering & thinking 'what if I did' for the rest of ones life.

    Besides, Eurofighter GmbH & Co need a spot of good news regarding exports, I don't think they want to call South Korea's bluff, don't you?

    Re: Saab, I was under the impression that they pulled out soon after Sukhoi. Unless I've missed a more recent report stating they're back in the running.

  8. #8
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    @ EELightning

    thing is, Korea will even more certainly go for a US design than Japan. The US won't let any market they can take to anyone else, as with the SK's northern "neighbours" the US supposrt is seen as extremely valuable.

    As a result, any non-US company participating there is just loosing its time. The only thing Eurofighter guys can expect is something along the lines the Rafale guys got overthere in the previous competition:

    the "satisfaction" to say "we won the competition before the politicians decided to go for a US product"

    now one can wonder if it's worth the investment to go there just to try to get that. Dassault already answered to that question in Japan: they didn't even bother participating (why spend time and money just to get the japanese a better deal from a US firm?)

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    Quote Originally Posted by TooCool_12f View Post
    now one can wonder if it's worth the investment to go there just to try to get that. Dassault already answered to that question in Japan: they didn't even bother participating (why spend time and money just to get the japanese a better deal from a US firm?)
    It helps slash the profits of your direct competitors. Thanks to airbus going for the US tanker competition, they managed to force Boeing to make massive cuts on their profits. In the long run it will cost Boeing much more than it cost airbus I think.

    Nic
    "allah akbar": NATO's new warcry.

  10. #10
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    It's unlikely but since the US are buying less than previously planned, some other country might be convince to receive those plane the US no longer plan on buying.
    In any case I believe it's going to be between F-15 and F-35.

    In the end even Airbus refused to bid for the tanker competition. One should know when to stop losing money after hopeless causes.
    “Nothing is impossible, the word itself says 'I'm possible'!”

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    boeing still will make loads of money on the tanker deal. airbus only spent money... there's no comparison

    in the end, it's always the same: the winners makes money, the looser looses. running in a competition where it's been clear you won't be allowed to win the final contract is just wasting money. if a country has already decided who it will buy from: let them pay the price

  12. #12
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    Quote Originally Posted by TooCool_12f View Post
    boeing still will make loads of money on the tanker deal. airbus only spent money... there's no comparison

    in the end, it's always the same: the winners makes money, the looser looses. running in a competition where it's been clear you won't be allowed to win the final contract is just wasting money. if a country has already decided who it will buy from: let them pay the price
    Boeing was milking the USAF so they could be much more competitive on other markets where it was competing directly with Airbus. Their profit on the tanker deal, which is huge, have been cut dramatically. The price of their aircraft have been near cut in half.

    Nic
    "allah akbar": NATO's new warcry.

  13. #13
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    So there was this article
    http://www.koreatimes.co.kr/www/news...05_106346.html

    and now our DAPA (Defence Acquisition Programme Agency) Aircraft division has a reply

    http://www.dapa.go.kr/internet/infor...ticleSeq=10288


    “한국 공군의 차기전투기사업(F-X)에서 가장 유력한 기종으로 꼽히고 있는 록히드마틴사의 F-35" 라는 부분에 대해서, 업체가 제안서도 제출하지 않은 현 시점에서 특정 업체나 기종이 유력하다고 언급하는 것 자체가 옳지 않습니다.

    ("The LM F-35 is considered the most preferred for the ROKAF F-X program" Companies have not submitted a proposal at this point so to mention that a particular vendor or model is preferred in itself is wrong.)

    “F-35를 선정할 경우 개발지연으로 인해 도입일정에 차질이 불가피 할 것”이라는 부분에 대해서는, 평가과정에서 우리의 도입일정을 충족하지 못하는 기종은 탈락시킬 것입니다.

    ("If the F-35 is selected development delays will make the delay of the (F-35s) introduction inevitable." During the evaluation process if any model does not meet our introduction schedule will be eliminated.)

    “록히드마틴사의 F-35 전투기가 선정될 경우 납품에 지연이 발생되어도 이에 따른 손해배상을 청구하기 힘들 것" 이라는 언급에 대해서는 어떤 기종이 선정되던 계약서에 명시된 납품 시기를 충족하지 못할 경우 지체상금 부과를 포함한 각종 제재조치(制裁措置)를 취할 계획입니다.

    ("If Lockheed Martin's F-35 fighter is selected even if delivery delays occurs a compensation would be difficult" Whichever model is selected if delivery times specified in the contract are not met various sanctions, including the imposition of various sanctions(制裁 措置) including liquidated damages is planned to take place.)

    Keep in mind the korean and english articles (from the KT) are different so you won't find the quotes from my translation (which is bad but I wanted to keep the most about of meaning even with some broken English)

    Also there are similar ones replying for different things like f-35 external weapons and FMS and the LM guy saying that we promised to buy the F-35. (So ask if you want some)
    Last edited by EagleSpirit; 16th March 2012 at 12:16.

  14. #14
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    Is there an English language list of criterion for this competition available somewhere?

    It's always seemed to me like more F-16s would be the answer, given their proven strike capability and ample capacity to handle the DPRK AF. F-16 is already in service and can be provided at a much lower price than the other competitors.

    It's coming towards the end of it's US service, to be sure, but other nations are still buying new, and I can't see the DPRK being able to afford any new aircraft in worthwhile numbers for a very long time.
    "Quicquid agas age"

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