TR1's Great Russian Aviation Thread 7,the return of Timofey Mozgov

[killerbean]

Fighters A/C usually take the limelight, but this thing is remarkable pieces of equipment.

PS: Why wasn't the Ka-52 not in the Indian competition with the Mi-28 & AH-64?

Maybe cuz the Ka-52 doesnt have a main cannon turret.

http://idp.justthe80.com/air-force-p...e-Requirements

The IAF wants these gunships to be highly-agile, have good armor protection and a 20mm caliber turret gun, as also be capable of firing 70mm rockets with a 1.2-km range and missiles with at least 7-km range.

Maybe the IN will get some of these for its LHDs (either Ka-52s or the LCHs).

[haavarla]

It is less political the factories in siberia are building Sukhois with wages higher than regional but considerably lower than say St.Petersburg which is dominant political.when you compare to other modern projects like EF/JSF/F-18.where supply chain is well spread out around the world and have no relationships with previous generation.
http://www.volvoaero.com/volvoaero/g...ages/f135.aspx

I am pretty sure unifying cockpit design, engines, weopons and factory sharing Su-35 & T-50 will lower the cost and reduce training/maintainance costs.

If one look isolated on the defence industry in Russia, it are indeed focused on a few industrilized hotspots, Moscow region, Sibirian KnAAPO, ULAN-** and far-east Irkutsk region. These heavy eco-locomotives are widly spread from each other, they are quite compacted pockets of high-end know-how R&D factories. And very little infra structure in between them.

Also the high end defence industry in Russia will dominate the Russian economic growt for decades to came, if one disregard the Russian gas/oil revenues..

That a good portion of Russias defence industy are state owned or partly state owned, this does not mean they can't be competitive vs western private firms like LM etc etc..

Just check out how monster companies like Statoil, which are build up by our state and partly state owned. They are pretty much our own eco-locomotive which drive our economy.

[JSR]

If one look isolated on the defence industry in Russia, it are indeed focused on a few industrilized hotspots, Moscow region, Sibirian KnAAPO, ULAN-** and far-east Irkutsk region. These heavy eco-locomotives are widly spread from each other, they are quite compacted pockets of high-end know-how R&D factories. And very little infra structure in between them.

Also the high end defence industry in Russia will dominate the Russian economic growt for decades to came, if one disregard the Russian gas/oil revenues..

That a good portion of Russias defence industy are state owned or partly state owned, this does not mean they can't be competitive vs western private firms like LM etc etc..

Just check out how monster companies like Statoil, which are build up by our state and partly state owned. They are pretty much our own eco-locomotive which drive our economy.

Statoil is wealthy firm but it does not mean it is not depended on imported equipment and imported engineering talent to run its operations. Norway is possibly only country in world where nominal GDP is twice of PPP GDP. so people are more living on welfare or paid more than for what they produce.
Russian firms have much deeper engineering strenght in there fields.The difficult part of Turkemnistan-China pipeline is built by Russian firm.
http://www.stroytransgaz.com/press-c...ass/2009_10_23

I was looking at Volvoaero they are hiring all over the places in world.
You wont see Salut-Saturn advertizing like hiring in India/China or any other country to build engines for Russia. THere is still level of independence from outside world that make things expensive. so it does not matter whether state owned or not.
Infact Su-30SM imported equipment is replaced at 150m roubles. this shows how cheaply and quickly the imported stuff can be replace.It i s not the price but how and where you built things.
https://research.zecco.com/research/...lastPage=Index

[TR1]

http://russianplanes.net/ID71228

Good pic of that Grey Su-25. Looks much better from bottom, when the colors don't clash.

[TR1]

http://russianplanes.net/ID71263

Su-25BM, not a common sight. What is the payload?

[a89]

Isn't there a contract for 16 Su-25UBM ? Where are they going to be built?

Most modern version of Su-25 use the UB version as a base. The space for the second crew is filled with fuel/equipment.

Some more info about that Su-25SM3

Contract for 36 Su-25SM3 currently underway at the 121st Repair Plant. First 8 handed over in 2011, 16 this year, and 12 in 2013.

Are there any updates regarding a new contract for newly built aircraft. a while ago it was announced that Ulan-Ude would start production of the Su-25. Note extravagant title:

http://en.rian.ru/analysis/20101125/161501297.html

[TR1]

Yeah, Ulan-Ude already built a Su-25UBM or two, and they have been in trials for a while now. Keep hearing news about how the trials have been passed.

[Trident]

http://russianplanes.net/ID71263

Su-25BM, not a common sight. What is the payload?

Intriguing for sure - while they look a lot like gun-pods at first glance, there is no muzzle to be seen. This being a -BM, maybe they house the towed targets?

[martinez]

Intriguing for sure - while they look a lot like gun-pods at first glance, there is no muzzle to be seen. This being a -BM, maybe they house the towed targets?

I guess those are cargo/travel pods for smuggling vodka and other maintenance equipment, I can see two big access doors with quick-release fasteners for loading/unloading operations....

[TR1]

http://cdn-www.airliners.net/aviatio.../9/1622952.jpg

ANyone have a large res, wallpaper sized, Berkut photo?

Much love to anyone who does.

[TR1]

http://s52.radikal.ru/i136/0906/c1/18f53f681831.jpg

Have not seen this one before, nabbed it from Paralay's.

[TR1]

http://forums.airbase.ru/2012/03/t70...u-35.6620.html

On the 21st of this month, Bogdan completed the 500th test flight of the Su-35C program.

[killerbean]

How the Ka-52 Alligator is made: A guided tour of the helicopter factory
http://en.rian.ru/video/20110907/166497435.html

[TR1]

http://sandrermakoff.livejournal.com/22177.html
Great overview of MiG-29SMT operations @ Kursk.

Some interesting points:
-internal fuel capacity increased to 6100 liters
-Due to the new service system (you can see the laptop being plugged in), extended service life from 4000 to 6000 hours, 40% cheaper flight hour, the plane is considered 3.3 times more cost effective than the vanilla MiG-29.

EDIT:

Also Mi-35 contract with Brazil has been resumed, after a financial delay.

[Twinblade]

http://en.ria.ru/analysis/20120323/172357523.html

According to this article, cost is a major factor in opting for Su-30 SM.
Also, why does the infographic mention only 6 A2A missile when it has been photographed with all hardpoints loaded with a2a missiles ?

[haavarla]

That is easy to answer Twinblade.
On any standard patrol, CAP or border escorting missions, you will allways see an VVS Flanker with 6 A2A missiles(2 short, 4 medium/long range).
Why? Cause this believe it or not are indeed the standard load-up chart.

If you strap any more missiles on it, the Drag/Weight penalty goes above a certain limit, which is not recomended for several reasons.

So why all those pics with Flankers with 8-10 missiles?
It has little to do with reality. Mostly for advertizing reasons.

Also keep in mind, that the Su-35S will often carry those jammer pods on the wingtip stations. So in reality, it fly with 8 stations occupied.

[haavarla]

http://sandrermakoff.livejournal.com/22177.html
Great overview of MiG-29SMT operations @ Kursk.

Some interesting points:
-internal fuel capacity increased to 6100 liters
-Due to the new service system (you can see the laptop being plugged in), extended service life from 4000 to 6000 hours, 40% cheaper flight hour, the plane is considered 3.3 times more cost effective than the vanilla MiG-29.

EDIT:

Also Mi-35 contract with Brazil has been resumed, after a financial delay.

Wow, great find TR1. Thx.
Hmm, arent that 6100 liter with that senterlined fueltank TR1?

[Corrosion]

While I am ready to believe that 6 missiles could be some sort of optimal aerodynamic configuration but that info graphic "up to 6 A-A missiles" is wrong.

I would say that info-graphic is supposed to be an advertisement and RIA messed it up.

[Flanker_man]

While I am ready to believe that 6 missiles could be some sort of optimal aerodynamic configuration but that info graphic "up to 6 A-A missiles" is wrong.

I would say that info-graphic is supposed to be an advertisement and RIA messed it up.

They also illustrate it with an Indian AF Su-30K - one of the initial batch of 18 sold to India prior to the 'real' Su-30MKI's being delivered.

The first 8 lacked any multi-role capability and were only air-defence configured.

Ken

[mack8]

Grey Su-25SM

http://russianplanes.net/ID71438

Now, what is Airwolf saying about MiG-29M 747 in the comments ?Google translate doesn't make any sense!

[dionis]

Grey Su-25SM

http://russianplanes.net/ID71438

Now, what is Airwolf saying about MiG-29M 747 in the comments ?Google translate doesn't make any sense!

What's that Frogfoot packing in the nose?

[Flanker_man]

What's that Frogfoot packing in the nose?

A red cover over the laser designator ???

Ken

[TR1]

Grey Su-25SM

http://russianplanes.net/ID71438

Now, what is Airwolf saying about MiG-29M 747 in the comments ?Google translate doesn't make any sense!

He said it would be better if they did not paint it at all, so it would be like MiG-29M 747.

EDIT:
http://russianplanes.net/ID71425

Another pic of the bird.

[mack8]

Thanks TR1. Looks like almost no one likes this new gray ...

On another matter , speaking of MiG-29M 747, anyone knows if there's anything new about it ? Where are 747 and 741 now, are they still in LII or they left, no pics of them in long time again . Have they been painted yet ? Anything ?

Thanks.

[martinez]

Grey Su-25SM

http://russianplanes.net/ID71438

Now, what is Airwolf saying about MiG-29M 747 in the comments ?Google translate doesn't make any sense!

All I find dumb on this camo is using a tape to create the hard-edge between grey and baby blue color, especially in the middle of wing leading edge. The worst place, prone to paint peeling. Anyway, the Su-25 camo would look better if the line between colors was painted freehand, with some diffusion.

[dionis]

A red cover over the laser designator ???

Ken

The rad-warning on the nose...

[a89]

VVS acquisition of Flanker class aircraft. Identified contracts:

- 30 Su-30SM (March 2012)
- 92 Su-34 (February 2012)
- 48 Su-35 (August 2009)
- 12 Su-27SM3 (August 2009)
- 4 Su-30M2 (August 2009)

In another forum I have been discussing about the acquistion of Su-30SM, Su-30M2 and Su-27SM3. Summary of each version:

- Su-30SM: Russian version of Su-30MKI. It's built in IAPO and some (if not all) of the foreign equipment will be replaced by Russian.
- Su-30M2: Russian version of Su-30MK2 (exported to China), built at KnAAPO. Its less advanced than the MKI version in terms of avionics, life and other parameters.
- Su-27SM3: Built using components from cancelled Chinese Su-27SK. They are modernized to SM3 standard before going into service.

I would like some opinions on why the VVS is acquiring Su-30SM, Su-30M2 and Su-27SM3.

- Some people think that this is a good oportunity for VVS to get Flankers at good price. As the variants have already been exported, there is no much need for testing. Manufacture would be quick and it would help to build up numbers.

- Some others think that this have to do with politics. VVS decided to help KnAAPO by buying some Su-27SK left at the factory, and IAPO was then compensated. Otherwise they would get more Su-34/35. The MiG-29SMT case would be a similar one.

[Berkut]

First off, the order on Su-34 isnt 92, it is 124 in total. 92 is just the new contract.

They bought Su-27SM3's and M2's as these were zero hour frames from earlier contracts that were not finished/canceled/whatever. So they got them cheap probably. Gives work to KnAAPO as well and rids of unused frames.

[MSphere]

Just like with the undelivered Algerian SMTs.
The original contract was 28+6 planes for $1.3 bln.
Russian VVS got them for $780mil.

[totoro]

Is there a source that confirms how many planes russians use in their squadrons?

How many planes per fighter sqadron? How many per attack plane squadron? Per recce squadron? And how many bombers in bomber squadrons?

I see 16 as a figure that seems likely, but i've no idea if it's true, nor if it is applicable across the board, for all kinds of squadrons and planes.

Can anyone help with a proper source solving this little mystery?