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Thread: "Spitfire" Production line re-opened / Enstone (merged)

  1. #1
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    "Spitfire" Production line re-opened / Enstone (merged)

    Surprised no-one else has mentioned this to date, but a project is underway in Oxford to build a dozen Spitfires - albeit the Australian designed "Mark 26B" 90% scale replica.

    According to the report, volunteers are still needed to assist with completion of the project, quote

    "Twenty volunteers are constructing the first Spitfire, but more helpers are needed to build the other 11. It's hoped the new City of Oxford squadron, as it will be known, will be completed by December. As well as pilots, it will include ground crews, engineers, and aeroplane and military vehicle enthusiasts".

    Read more: http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/arti...#ixzz1iTiNsRyF

    If the pictures and video are correct, this is not a mere pipe dream - one aircraft is already under construction. Any forum members is the Enstone/Oxford area know more about this?

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    90%! why not go the whole hog and add the other 10% and lets have them full sized.
    Forwarned is Forearmed.

  3. #3
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    WOW!! I just can't wait to hear the roar of the "V6" Isuzu engine burst into life. Ther'es just no substitute for the real thing.
    Jim.

    Lincoln .7
    There is no such thing as a problem, just a solution!!

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    Quote Originally Posted by Lincoln 7 View Post
    WOW!! I just can't wait to hear the roar of the "V6" Isuzu engine burst into life. Ther'es just no substitute for the real thing.
    Jim.

    Lincoln .7
    There's one out here (Strayliya) with a V8 Chev, sounds brilliant when it comes roaring past. It's a polished metal finish with roundals and looks fantastic. For those who can't afford the 4 or 5 million for a full size and have a few dollars to spare these one's are triffic. How would one with a Jag V12 go? There were a mob in the States doing conversions of Jag engines for Aircraft, they had them in 80% P40's.
    http://www.google.com.au/imgres?imgu...%3Divns&itbs=1

    http://www.recreationalpilots.com.au...p?image_id=797

    http://www.recreationalpilots.com.au...98&mode=search
    Last edited by Student Pilot; 4th January 2012 at 10:10.
    If I wasn't a never was I could have been a hasbeen

  5. #5
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    Like anything else, only the real thing will do.

    Can't wait to hear the roar as the "Squadron" flies overhead
    Safety first. Always.

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    A group of LAA enthusiasts building modern kitplanes (all be it very pretty ones) is a GA, not Historic topic surely?

    I have taken the liberty of repositioning it for you.

    Moggy
    Moderator

  7. #7
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    Quote Originally Posted by merlinai159 View Post
    90%! why not go the whole hog and add the other 10% and lets have them full sized.
    1) Scale replicas are cheaper by a factor of about 20 times - say £150,000 as against £3 million

    2) Scale replicas can be built a lot quicker

    3) Scale replicas are easier for civilian trained pilots (PPL) to fly

    4) Scale replicas are cheaper to insure, run, maintain (Avgas is now £2.00 litre)

    Need I go on?

    Moggy
    "What you must remember" Flip said "is that nine-tenths of Cattermole's charm lies beneath the surface." Many agreed.

  8. #8
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    Moggs, Thats YOUR New Years Resolution up the spout..
    Jim.

    Lincoln .7
    There is no such thing as a problem, just a solution!!

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    Yes I know, but the good Doctor is an infrequent poster so got gentler treatment than the reprobates can expect. Now get back on topic or you are in big time trouble!



    Moggy
    "What you must remember" Flip said "is that nine-tenths of Cattermole's charm lies beneath the surface." Many agreed.

  10. #10
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    Yeah, i'm down the road from Enstone, i have heard about this idea, can't say it really grabs me either..............
    if their going to build a squadron, then why not build one real one !

    Anyway, i'm sure i'll take a look soon.

    Jules

  11. #11
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    Well, I have to give these chaps full marks if they can pull it off,somewon has very deep pockets to want a whole squadron of them.

    As an aside to the O.P. would it be feasable to build a 90% size Merlin engine?. If so, I wonder what it would cost, given design, toolling, machinery etc, etc.

    Jim.

    Lincoln .7
    There is no such thing as a problem, just a solution!!

  12. #12
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    Quote Originally Posted by Moggy C View Post
    A group of LAA enthusiasts building modern kitplanes (all be it very pretty ones) is a GA, not Historic topic surely?

    I have taken the liberty of repositioning it for you.

    Moggy
    Moderator
    Bet there is a fair chance they will carry periord "serials" !!!

    Planemike

  13. #13
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    Quote Originally Posted by Lincoln 7 View Post
    .. somewon has very deep pockets to want a whole squadron of them.
    Not really, that is the point of the replicas.

    As I understand it (I can't bring myself to read the Daily Wail's take on it) there will be ten owner/builders for each aircraft, so they are only looking at £15,000 each over a year or two. And unlike cars there is unlikely to be much in the way of depreciation, so that money is 'stored' rather than spent.

    £15,000 is not a lot for such an attractive permit aircraft.

    My main issue with the type is that it is not certified for aerobatics. A straight-and-level Spitfire just seems a contradiction in terms to me.

    Moggy
    "What you must remember" Flip said "is that nine-tenths of Cattermole's charm lies beneath the surface." Many agreed.

  14. #14
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    Twelve new Spitfires from Enstone

    To-days Telegraph carried a news item. Herewith as reported:

    "Aviation enthusiasts are beginning a year long project at Enstone Flying club, Oxfordshire, to build a squadron of twelve flightworthy Spifires"

    Does anyone know anything?


    John Green

  15. #15
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    From this morning, http://forum.keypublishing.com/showthread.php?t=114087

    They're not Spitfires, and certainly not Historic, which I'm guessing is why the thread was moved to General aviation.

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    pagen01

    Apologies one and all. When I put this on, I hadn't realised that it was recorded elsewhere in these Forums and the original writer was writing about scale replicas.

    John Green

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    I can understand the attraction to the owners although it does seem strange that the design is not certified for aerobatics.
    The article I read said that they were proposing to make them available as a squadron for airshow appearances but I have my doubts that any display organiser will want to stump up money for 10 identical 90% replicas when it is comparatively easy (although admittedly more expensive) to book the real thing which will have much more crowd appeal.
    I think we can say fairly safely that they "won't be at Legends".

  18. #18
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    Quote Originally Posted by Moggy C View Post
    My main issue with the type is that it is not certified for aerobatics. A straight-and-level Spitfire just seems a contradiction in terms to me.

    Moggy
    I think it depends on the registration method, in RAA or "Ultralight" catagory, no aircraft is aerobatic (I think). In VH or experimental I think they are, anyhoo they are stressed to +6-6 (I think agin, not sure). There are some out here that regulary do aero's. The V8 is an option with some of the kits, the V8 sounds VERY good on high power. I think your a bit off with the price, depends on kit again but the mob with the V6's and V8's are closer to $300,000 Oz dollars or about mebe 180,000 Poonds.
    They may not be exactly like originals but at least they fly and provide much fun for the owners.
    You can compare some of the whinging about them to blokes who say hey would only go out with Lizabeth Hurley (The cricket yobo's friend) and ignore the good sort check out chick then go home to the computor for internet "Love". There's the real, tangable, achievable (Even if it is a replica) and there's the impossible dreamers. Those that do and those that don't.
    If I wasn't a never was I could have been a hasbeen

  19. #19
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    The Spitfire 26B hasn't flown in this country yet as far as I'm aware, although the previous, smaller, version has.

    I believe, though I could be wrong, that the smaller version is rated for aeros. They're certainly capable!
    There is nothing to fear but fear itself. And spiders. F**k spiders.

    Daren Cogdon

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    Quote Originally Posted by Student Pilot View Post
    I think it depends on the registration method
    It does indeed and over here they come under the LAA scheme, and the word from the LAA is currently 'No aeros' for either version.

    Hopefully this will change.

    The procedure is for one of the type to be submitted for test flying by the LAA. If it is acceptable then each individual aircraft has to be approved in turn, there is no general approval.

    My RV4 was the first in the UK and was the actual example tested and approved by the LAA (Or PFA as it was then) opening the door for all the others

    Moggy
    Last edited by Moggy C; 4th January 2012 at 23:21.
    "What you must remember" Flip said "is that nine-tenths of Cattermole's charm lies beneath the surface." Many agreed.

  21. #21
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    Apart from the cost, what's the attraction of a 90% replica of the real thing?, Just a thought, and why a Spitfire?.
    I agree with Moggy, straight line flying would certainly not be anything like the "Real deal", and would hold no attraction to me at an air show.
    It will be very interesting to read the first review, when they test fly the first one.

    Jim.

    Lincoln .7
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  22. #22
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    Linc,

    The Spitfire is an incredibly attractive design and the replica, which falls within the LAA scheme, is the nearest most of us can ever dream of getting to Mitchell's tour de force. Simply that.

    For relatively little money you get some of the Spitfire experience in a practical and usable light aircraft. So if you have already decided to condemn yourself to lifelong penury by flying with your own money, then the Spit 26 is one of many options.

    I'd be tempted if it wasn't four times the price of my aircraft, yet delivering less. In fact I did register my interest at the start of the Enstone scheme, but distance made it impractical.

    Moggy
    "What you must remember" Flip said "is that nine-tenths of Cattermole's charm lies beneath the surface." Many agreed.

  23. #23
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    Quote Originally Posted by Moggy C View Post
    Linc,

    The Spitfire is an incredibly attractive design and the replica, which falls within the LAA scheme, is the nearest most of us can ever dream of getting to Mitchell's tour de force. Simply that.
    Moggs. I agree entirely with what you say, I am not in any way shape or form deriding the efforts of those building the replicas, just that I would be willing to eat bread and jam for the rest of my life, and have a 100% full size "Model" as no doubt, would we all.But as usual, it all boils down to money.
    Jim.
    Lincoln .7
    Last edited by Moggy C; 5th January 2012 at 13:24.
    There is no such thing as a problem, just a solution!!

  24. #24
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    Back in the 1980s, Clive DuCros set about building a full-scale replica of the prototype Spitfire, K5054. All-wood, with a converted 400hp Jaguar V-12 for power, it cost in the region of £100,000.... in 1980s money.

    Aside from the cost of the beast, Clive encountered a number of issues, mostly with the powerplant (specifically cooling). But it did fly, and quite well, too.
    There is nothing to fear but fear itself. And spiders. F**k spiders.

    Daren Cogdon

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    Quote Originally Posted by John Green View Post
    pagen01

    Apologies one and all.
    No need to apologise!
    Just to make it clear, I don't have anything against these Spitfire looking new builds and agree with what Moggy says about them.

  26. #26
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    For all you knockers of replica Spitfires. What would you rather fly, a replica, or nothing. That's the choice most of us have. As for flying one, you'd hardly notice the reduction in size. Here are a few photos taken at my field where one being built was visited by a completed one.
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  27. #27
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    I don't think any of us are "Knocking" as you say the replicas, indeed they are a nice loking aircraft in their own right. I think what we are saying, is that you cannot, and never will, beat the real deal.
    It's a similar case with Trout fishing, of which I do a lot in the season, there are those who like wet fly fishing, which is frowned upon by the purist who state true fly fishing is dry fly only.
    It's just a matter of an opinion worthy of discussion, in both cases.
    Jim.

    Lincoln .7
    Last edited by Lincoln 7; 6th January 2012 at 09:34.
    There is no such thing as a problem, just a solution!!

  28. #28
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    Here's a clip I've just found of the K5054 replica:

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jVaKixJv1lE
    There is nothing to fear but fear itself. And spiders. F**k spiders.

    Daren Cogdon

  29. #29
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    Back on topic, here's the Mk.26b being put through its paces in Oz:

    http://youtu.be/SnGf8NTOMKw
    There is nothing to fear but fear itself. And spiders. F**k spiders.

    Daren Cogdon

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    No one is knocking these A/C, they are a pretty A/C in their own right and its a great achivement to build and fly your own Aeroplane what ever it is.
    I think the problem arrises when people try to belive they are the real thing, they are not and never will be. Having news headline's of "Spitfire Producion Line reopened" is trying to miss lead and get somthing out of using the name "Spitfire".
    All that is happening here is a group of like minded enthusiasts have got together to build a number of modern reduced scale replica's in the same place. Nothing more and nothing less. If thats your bag all powre to you but dont get carried away by thinking you are a Warbird builder/pilot, you are not. You should however be very proud of your achivement in building and flying your replica.
    "I see something of the cobra in you Stachel!"

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