Chinese Air Power Thread 16

[Broccoli]

[J-31 Burrito]

Its a very good looking airplane. With the J-31 out, we can safely assume that PAF is an acceptable customer to sell this bird. They'll definitely need it.. replace their Mirages, Fantans, and other relics with this jet. Would be nice if they could replace their JF-17 with it too!

[thinkplum]

Its a very good looking airplane. With the J-31 out, we can safely assume that PAF is an acceptable customer to sell this bird. They'll definitely need it.. replace their Mirages, Fantans, and other relics with this jet. Would be nice if they could replace their JF-17 with it too!

they've put the plane on a set of white cylinders, air quality is not so good, what kind of test they were performing ?shouldn't they have a room with clean air to perform such kind of tests?

[MSphere]

That's a gd premium, not sure other fellow members going to agree this or not.
But so called standard MKIs are ordered 10 yeai ago?

Nope. The initial batches of Irkut built MKIs were sold for $37-38mil. HAL built examples were estimated at $22-25mil.

The $60-65mil quote is the last IAPO quote for India for a standard (means not nuclear) Flanker. I think it comes from late 2010 or early 2011.

[SGW06]

Russian DoD minister has already returned home and nothing being announced, it is safe to say this is just yet another round of Su-35 hoax started by Russian media and some of the patented boastful russian officers.

And to be fair, the most likely scenario is Russian officers trying to sell Su-35 to China every time there is a talk between the two sides, and the Chinese side rejected at everytime.

And then the Russian officers and their crap media has helped China buy this Su-35 crap evevry time there is such talk.

Some russians, including these media reporters and Defence officers, basically has ZERO SHAME and ZERO dignity.:diablo:

[TR1]

Yeah, China doesn't have a history of acquiring small (and sometimes very large!) quantities of Soviet/Russian equipment.

There is no way China was interested in several Su-35 like Rosoboronexport reported.

China, where Government and State-Sponsored media are always telling the truth. In fact, they are known for it.


Btw, what Russian officers have said the sale is happening?
Do our Chinese friends still have trouble grasping the difference between military officials, Rosoboronexport officials, and media-stories written by journalists?

It is hilarious how defense journalists (known for generally making goofs whatever country employs them) bring up such defensive feelings in the fanboys.

[Levsha]

I am sure China would indeed be interested in taking a handful of Su-35s for examination - in the same way that many companies in Russia would like to have a deeper look at the F-35 for something to learn, perhaps. But China is not going to spend several billion dollars acquiring a few dozen Su-35s, when such money can be better spend within China itself helping to develop Chinese R&D.

(I'm sure Lockheed themselves wouldn't say no to a few T-50s or J-20s)

[starikki]

they've put the plane on a set of white cylinders, air quality is not so good, what kind of test they were performing ?shouldn't they have a room with clean air to perform such kind of tests?

most likely some radar RCS tests

[starikki]

The first landing

http://news.xinhuanet.com/mil/2012-1..._123998037.htm

[Fedaykin]

Trapped the second wire which is hardly stellar but that will come with practice.

[foxmulder]

Trapped the second wire which is hardly stellar but that will come with practice.

what will be stellar?

[mack8]

Wow. This is a historic moment for China . Congratulations.

(to the above question, i think the third wire class as "stellar" , if i'm not mistaken)

[tphuang]

Yeah, China doesn't have a history of acquiring small (and sometimes very large!) quantities of Soviet/Russian equipment.

There is no way China was interested in several Su-35 like Rosoboronexport reported.

China, where Government and State-Sponsored media are always telling the truth. In fact, they are known for it.


Btw, what Russian officers have said the sale is happening?
Do our Chinese friends still have trouble grasping the difference between military officials, Rosoboronexport officials, and media-stories written by journalists?

It is hilarious how defense journalists (known for generally making goofs whatever country employs them) bring up such defensive feelings in the fanboys.

That's the way that Russians would look it I guess. Here is the thing, we've been reading for the past 5 years from Russian news that China wants to purchase Su-35. In some cases, it seemed like they were saying the sale was all but a done deal.

And honestly, it makes less and less sense for China to buy it as time goes on. They were far more likely to buy Su-33 back in the days and the Russians news even reported the deals were completed, but do you think any Su-33s with PLANAF these days? This story gets reports every 6 months to a year.

And in our SDF forum, we constantly have Russian posters coming over repeating this news over and over again. After a while, you have to think about how Chinese posters would receive this news.

Give it a rest already. Until there is real evidence, it just sounds like loud noise to keep repeating that you are talking and this might go through. We know they are talking. China always talks to Russia about military cooperation. I'm sure they talk about Su-35 all the time, but that doesn't mean a sale has happened. China has also been trying to sell T/R modules and AESA radars to Russia. Do you see the Russian news boasting about that? But go check one of the strategycenter article and one of many articles by kanwa (who only seems to interview his Russian friends), you see that's happening also.

Just because they are talking, do we need to hear more about it?

[Fedaykin]

what will be stellar?

Trapping the third wire on a four wire carrier is regarded as a safe trap in USN practice. Catching the second wire means he came up a bit short, not stellar but not massively dangerous. If the aircraft makes a perfect approach exactly on the ball then the jet will naturally snag the third wire. Catching the first wire is very dangerous as any shorter and the plane hits the rear of the ship. Catching the last wire is also dangerous as if the wire snaps then the aircraft will probably end up in the drink.

This is the first ever trap so snagging the second wire isn't a disaster also the mirror landing sight might not be perfectly adjusted yet. Then again the first trap will be after many touch and goes. I am not criticising the pilot as that would be hardly fair in the circumstances only observing that in the context of a safe trap it is hardly stellar as of yet. Notice I did say that it will come with practice, I suggest don't look for insult when none is meant!

Trapping a wire is difficult even for a pilot who has the benefit of decades of institutional experience. Have a look at this old video of an RAF pilot attempting to catch the wire on Ark Royal:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2bW7t...eature=related

[Trident]

IIRC snagging the second wire is considered a perfect trap on the Kuznetsov, which also has four wires and obviously represents by far the closest approximation in ship/aircraft combination to China's ex-Varyag/J-15. It's probably a function of aircraft approach path and deck geometry more than the number of wires - just because in USN practise a three-wire is optimum doesn't mean it is that way for all carriers with four wires.

[mack8]

Right, so the pilot actually made a perfect trap. Case closed.

[Fedaykin]

Well the latest American carriers only have three wires so trapping the second is perfect in that respect.

As I said the Chinese appear to be adopting American deck practice but I am not going to lose sleep over the matter as it is such a new event for China.

[Deino]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature...v=l9CDW4tlgOU#

[djcross]

they've put the plane on a set of white cylinders, air quality is not so good, what kind of test they were performing ?shouldn't they have a room with clean air to perform such kind of tests?

Look closely and you will see 3 aircraft jacks. One supports the nose between the radome and inlet. A second is under the right wing. And the 3rd is under the left wing, but is hidden from view by two men standing between the jack and camera.

Such a setup is often used to test landing gear function and door switch rigging adjustments.

You do not run the engine on jacks because the airplane will fall. You do not operate flight controls in high rate mode without the airplane being tied down, because the airplane will fall.

I do not the purpose of the white cylinders. They are too small in diameter to be RF anechoic shrouds to hide the jacks from an RCS imaging radar.

[Devils Advocate]

A picture is only a miniscule moment in time. Can't judge just by one.

[Fedaykin]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature...v=l9CDW4tlgOU#

Excellent! A bit late for your book

They certainly learnt from the Brazilians in respect of deck operations. Very similar to how the Americans do things, they even had a couple of shooters albeit no catapult!

Just for reference NAe Sao Paulo flight deck operations:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zp6_Li8DgiU

China had people on her for a while to learn about conventional carrier operations.

[gentle breeze]

：D some truly f&$#$#g hilarious stuff in China

[Trident]

LMAO! Nice to see a sense of humour there

[Broccoli]

This one looks a lot like Taranis from UK. Are we going to see something like this flying soon?

[Deino]

Oh my good !!! ... may he rest in peace.

Just found at the SDF.... posted by "Lion"

Shenyang SAC general manager died of heart attack onboard Liaoning CV after it successfully conducted its product of J-15 first landing and take off.



They claimed he died without regret. RIP...... You done a good job. Win back the pride of Shenyang SAC as leader of China military aviation from Chengdu!



He died 51 years of age.

Deino

[Fedaykin]

Real shame! Talk about going out on top, on the carrier just after the J-15 made it's first trap!

My condolences go out to the family, they should be proud!

[mack8]

RIP Mr. Luo, sad loss in such a special day for Chinese Aviation.

[thinkplum]

LMAO! Nice to see a sense of humour there

yepp, the cat one cracks me up...hard.

[swerve]

LMAO! Nice to see a sense of humour there

Interesting that even a girl in what looks like a workers dormitory is joining in. This has obviously been widely followed.

[starikki]

Interesting that even a girl in what looks like a workers dormitory is joining in. This has obviously been widely followed.

if you meant the girl with the yellow top, that is a typical university dorm layout
not up to a nice standard, but hell a whole year there probably cost the same as a week's rent for a student flat in UK...